Baby Boy or Girl Fitzpatrick, Sibling to Hugh and Claire

Sarah writes:

I’ve enjoyed reading your advice. I wonder if you could help my husband and I….I’m due in two weeks (end of Jan. 2012) and we’re still struggling (stressing a bit) with baby names. We have two children (Hugh Thomas age 4, Claire Ann age 3). We don’t know if we’re having a boy or a girl. (Hugh is a family name…starting with my grandfather and it goes way back and Thomas is my father-in-law. Claire was just a name we liked and Ann is a favorite family name on both sides.) Our last name is Irish – sounds like Fitzpatrick. My husband’s ancestry is all Irish – I’m of Irish and Scottish descent.

One boy name that we both like is Grant Regan. Grant is another family name and Regan is a family surname. I would love your thoughts on a quick question regarding this…do you think we’re crazy to have sons named Hugh and Grant since there is an actor named Hugh Grant? (For the record I like Hugh Grant so I don’t have bad associations with his name.)

Some of the other boys names we’re considering are:

George Regan (George – after my father + husband’s grandfather)
Cormac Regan (Cormac – a shortened version of a family surname name)
Cormac George

Our hesitation with Cormac is that there are conflicting defintitions – one is impure son (not so nice), others are son of charioteer or raven. I’m not sure how much weight to give these definitions or if I should let the family tie of the name matter more.

For girls we’re even more lost. Here are some we’ve been thinking of:

Alexandra Christine (I’ve always loved Alexandra and Christine is after my late mother-in-law)
Alexandra Regan
Alexandra Jane
Sadie Christine
Mollie Katherine
Katherine Regan
Alice Regan
Alice Christine
Georgia Regan
Abigail Regan
Flora Christine

Any thoughts or ideas would be most welcome!

I will make this quick so the other commenters can get at it too: it’s already been a week since you wrote, so TIME IS SHORT.

Brothers named Hugh and Grant immediately bring the actor to mind, and for me it’s to startling and comic effect. Like siblings named Ronald and Reagan, or Charles and Darwin. I vote no—but with great regret. If nothing else, I think you and they would get completely fed up with people remarking on the connection.

Instead I suggest Graham (even this is a little close, but it helps that there is a sister in between), Reid, or Dean. (I wish I could recommend Clark, too, but I think it’s too close to Claire.)

And I love your idea of George, and feel like pushing you to use it. George Regan! Very handsome. That’s my favorite.

The iffy definition of Cormac wouldn’t bother me. I looked it up in The Oxford Dictionary of First Names, and it says “Traditional Irish name of uncertain origin.” This name, like many, many, many others, has no standard meaning; meanings found in other books have been made up (with various degrees of legitimacy) to please people who like all names to have meanings.

The family tie is definitely more important here: the meaning of the name becomes THAT connection, rather than something from a baby name book, just as the meaning of George for your family is “mother’s father and father’s grandfather” rather than “farmer.” And I would get a copy of the Oxford book, put it on the bookshelf, and refer to that if little Cormac ever looks up his name in some other book and comes to you to confront you with your choice. “The Oxford Dictionary says so, Cormac!” you can say. “Uncertain origin!”

Wasn’t I planning to make this SHORT? Then we’d better move along to girl names.

With Claire, my stand-out favorite from your great list is Alice. In the next tier of favorites are Georgia, Abigail, Flora, and Mollie (which I’d spell Molly unless the spelling has significance).

I also suggest Eve and Eliza and Rose.

Let’s turn it over to the commenters now. Which boy name and girl name are your favorites for Baby Fitzpatrick?

Name update! Sarah writes:

Hello everyone – Thank you all for your help! We had a little (6 lb. 2 oz.) girl at the end of January. I was so convinced that we were having a boy that I had to ask twice when they told me we had a girl. My husband and I were set on using either Cormac George or George Regan so we were surprised to have to come up with a girl name! We named our daughter Alexandra Jane – even though it is a longer name than our other children it really seems to suit her well.

Thanks again for all of your comments!

Baby Boy Thompson, Brother to Charlotte Grace

31 Replies

Teresa writes:

Hello there Swistle! I’ve been reading your blog (semi-obsessively) for some time now and have often thought of writing, but always talked myself out of it (because I know you guys get so much mail). Now, however, I’m reaching a desperate point. I am pregnant with #2, a little boy, due May 22. My husband is deploying and will be leaving in March, and since he’ll miss the birth, the 2 baby-related bonding-type things I had hoped we’d be able to do together was the ultrasound and agreeing on a name. The ultrasound is done, but now we are stuck. We are in completely different galaxies when it comes to boy names.

Our daughter is named Charlotte Grace (which wasn’t as popular when we chose it as it is now). Our last name is Thompson. My favorite names so far are Oliver, Atticus, and Abraham (Abraham is my favorite by far). My husband can’t tolerate any of those. He prefers names like Timothy and Andrew, which are great names, just not for this baby. The one name that we theoretically *could* compromise and agree on is Calvin, but I’m not totally sold on it. If we have more children and didn’t start their name with a C name, would they feel left out? (I feel like this may be less of a concern because Charlotte doesn’t have a hard “c” sound, but am still not totally sure.) I do not want a first name that begins with T. My initials have always been TT, and I think it is too much of a strong T-sound.

We go to a fairly small, very close-knit church with an abundance of baby boys, so there are QUITE a few names that are out (and these are only the names that would be in the same class as this baby). Names that are out: Judah, Christian, Elijah, Levi, Luke, Seth, Sebastian, Liam, Ethan, Griffin/Finn.

We both liked Tobias at first, until we started test-driving it (and then we both liked it a lot less). And related Elias is out because of a horrible person one of us knew. Jeremiah could be a candidate, but it’s a name that I only like and do not love. If this baby was a girl, she would have been named Opal Elizabeth, which is a name that I really DO love, so now I’m just having a hard time settling for a boy name that I can only tolerate. Does that make any sense? I would prefer a less common name – I am not against popular names just for the sake of being different, but so our kid wouldn’t always have to be identified by their first name and last initial. I theoretically love Puritan/Colonial names, but looking through list after list of those types of names, I have found nothing inspirational.

Any help or guidance you could give would be greatly appreciated! Because of some training my husband has, he is only going to be home for another 5 weeks or so before he leaves in March. For some reason I am really feeling the time crunch lately, and for some other reason (probably crazy pregnancy hormones, I’m guessing), the thought of having to agree on a name via Skype with him across the world makes me cry. (Though I am thankful for the existence of Skype that will allow us to keep in touch, I really am. I just want the name agreeing to be done in person.)

Thank you again for your time!

To me, it’s the third name in a row that causes the real pressure—but I do feel some pressure even with a second name in a row, so I’d understand if you wanted to avoid a C name. But if I heard of a sibling group Charlotte, Calvin, and Opal, I wouldn’t think, “What, did they run out of C names?” (with Charlotte, Calvin, Colin, and Opal, I might). And although I’m sure we could find adults still upset that they didn’t share initials with their siblings, my guess is that the majority of children don’t care about such things unless it’s really blatant (and even then, we get people who say it made them feel special, not excluded). If you DID have Charlotte, Calvin, Colin, and Opal, and you said, “Opal, I waited through TWO BOYS to get to use your name!,” it seems like there’d be very little room left for feeling neglected.

I think Calvin would be a wonderful choice. It seems like an excellent compromise between your husband’s style and your own, and I’m not sure we can do any better than that. Which is not to say we won’t try, because trying is fun.

Henry is another name that I think can bridge the gap between Oliver and Andrew. Henry Thompson is great, I think. But what really sells it to me is the sibling name set: Charlotte and Henry. I love that. I love it enough that I had a little heart attack thinking “Wait, is it in their church group??”—followed by a very pleasant headrush when it wasn’t.

If Henry is too common, I wonder if you’d like Harvey. That’s a name that never would have caught my eye if I hadn’t been a fan of Sabrina the Teenage Witch. The cool-but-nice boyfriend is named Harvey.

Tobias and Elias make me think of Silas. Silas Thompson; Charlotte and Silas.

Silas makes me think of Simon. Simon Thompson. Too rhymey, or nicely tied together? Charlotte and Simon is a pair I like almost as much as I like Charlotte and Henry.

Henry and Silas make me think of Harris. Harris Thompson; Charlotte and Harris.

I looked up lists of signers of the Constitution and signers of the Declaration of Independence to see if any early U.S. names stood out. In those lists I found what I consider a real option, a name that came up again and again—but it’s the kind of name I feel like I need to introduce by saying something like “Now don’t reject it right away! Let it sink in!” It’s George. George Thompson. Charlotte and George. I like George enough to consider it using it myself, but it took awhile to start seeing it as a real name candidate, and I’m not sure why. Maybe it’s a name like John, so familiar it sort of flits right past without sinking in? But think for a moment of George Clooney. See? GEORGE. I think it’s the kind of name that has the potential to be a continual pleasant surprise: it’s got dignity and it’s got charm and it’s got HISTORY. (And it’s got Clooney.)

Another is Philip. A friend named her son Philip, and it has been such a successful name. I’m not sure I noticed it when I read baby name books, but as soon as she mentioned it I thought “Philip!! Why have we not considered Philip??” Philip Johnson; Charlotte and Philip.

Another name that caught my eye was Nathaniel. That seems closer to your husband’s tastes than to yours, but still might work as a compromise. Nathaniel Thompson; Charlotte and Nathaniel.

There’s an Edmund listed under “Other Founders,” and I think that name would work very nicely. Edmund Thompson; Charlotte and Edmund.

Looking over the list brought the name Joel (not on the lists) to mind. It has that hard-working early American sound. Joel Thompson; Charlotte and Joel.

Or Grant. Grant Thompson; Charlotte and Grant.

Baby Naming Issue: Place Names, Specifically Marina

46 Replies

Traci writes:

You helped me out less than a year ago when we were expecting our first. Now we’re expecting AGAIN.
Besides the craziness that is having two babies less than a year apart, we have a new naming issue.
We don’t know the gender of this baby, but if it is a girl, we would like to name her Marina Lynn, after both our mothers. (His mother = Marina, Mine = Lynn). I love most everything about the name Marina. I love that my husband loves it, I love the way it sounds, I love that it is a precious namesake like our first child. The ONLY THING I don’t like about it is that Marina is a thing in English. (A place, actually. “Let’s have lunch at the marina.”) To me, a name that is a thing/place like Marina is different than a name that is a thing like Rose. I can’t explain why, exactly, but it just bothers me. As an avid reader of your site (and because you steered us so right the first time and we took your advice and couldn’t be happier!) I thought that I’d get your take on it. Should I get over it? Is there a way to frame it that might help me get over it? I also thought of spelling it Marinah. Does that seem like a viable solution? Is there another solution I haven’t thought of? I thought you might take the opportunity to talk about names that are things (or places) in general, to help more readers than just me.

Thank you!

This is the kind of question where I have to rein in my urge to PUSH you to use the name. You love it! It’s a family name! Place names are a totally valid category of names! I want to FORCE the place issue not to bother you! But if something bothers, it bothers, and there’s no “just don’t let it” about it. So let’s work on the reframing idea.

In this particular case, it would influence me whether you live near a marina or not. DO you ever suggest having lunch at the marina, or is there no marina? Proximity/confusion issues matter to me, which is why I also wouldn’t suggest using Madison in or near Madison, Wisconsin, or Brooklyn in or near Brooklyn, New York—but wouldn’t blink at either one of them used in Michigan. But of course people can move later on, so it still doesn’t dismiss the point.

It also matters to me how tied the name is to the place. I don’t immediately think of Madison and Savannah and Florence as place names even though I know they are; Georgia is definitely a place name but also strongly a name-name; and India and Ireland are places until I shake off the confusion and realize that in this case it’s someone’s name. For me, Marina is somewhere between Savannah and Georgia: I’d know it was a place, and I’d know to take that into account—but it wouldn’t bother me to use it, even knowing that the child might later move to Georgia or near a marina/savannah.

In fact, maybe it would help to think how quickly a place association can vanish. Brittany! Austin! Jordan! Devon! Cody! Chelsea!

Or, this one may backfire, but: do you think of a marina whenever your mother-in-law’s name comes up? (If so, never mind and forget I said anything.) Has anyone you know ever commented on the connection? (“Marina? Oh, like the place we have lunch!”)

Or it helps me to think about how serious a situation it would be if the connection WERE made, or if the child DID move later on. How much of a problem/issue would it be for a girl named Madison to live in Wisconsin? There were 152 more of them born there last year, so my guess is it’s not too bad. And Brooklyn is #15 in New York even though it’s only #34 nationally. Place names are common honor names, so the connection can be a positive one.

Do you LIKE marinas? If someone hates roses, Rose is probably a non-starter of a baby name for them; but if they love roses, it adds to the appeal and makes the name an even more personal choice. The appeal of a forest or a haven or a savannah or a sky can be the very thing that makes someone CHOOSE a name like Forrest or Haven or Savannah or Skye.

Marinas are pretty.

It’s too bad about Mirena, or I’d recommend that spelling. Marinah looks like mah-RY-nah to me, probably because of Mariah. I suppose you could use Marena (though I might say that one mare-ree-na or mah-RAY-nah instead of mah-REE-nah), but I think it’s probably best to stick with the standard spelling.

Name update:

Hello, Swistle!

You helped me name our first child, and then we had a question about our second child who we wanted to name Marina. That child was born a beautiful baby boy. Four years later we welcomed our third child, a girl. We named her Marina Lynn, after her two grandmothers. We took your wonderful advice and kept the name as it was, without changing the spelling. We are thrilled. We love the name, and it suits her. I don’t have any hangups about a Marina being an actual place (in part because we no longer live near a marina.) Also, my mother was incredibly touched and honored at the namesake. Thank you for your great advice! Even years later it’s helpful. You helped us name two out of three of our children.

Oh here’s a photo of little miss Marina Lynn!

Middle Name Challenge: Rhys Kelly or Olive Kelly

15 Replies

Alison writes:

Hi there! Came across your blog in search of a non-lame baby naming source, and I am already swooning over you and your worker bees.

Here’s our situation.

Background: Husband in a musician, I’m an corp junkie and a yoga/dance teacher during my off hours.

Requirements: Want a non-lame name, that works for a rockstar, a poet or a school teacher. As versatile as possible. We have no middle name requirements, As long at it sounds great, we are happy.

We are unsure of the sex of the baby although we will be hoping to find out prior to the birth. Although our first pregnancy, my husband comes from a massive family so many traditional/biblical names are spoken for. Not that I’m religious (as we are not) but just a heads up. Also, our pets names are Seamus, Pickles and Bonham. Just in case you were thinking Pickles :)

For a boy, we love the name Rhys. Our last name is Kelly, so we want to find a middle name that completes what we deem is a rockin’ name.

For a girl, we have yet to find any names that we love. Names that we like but not love are Juliet, Violet and Sloan.

Thanks in advance for your help and your tremendous blog.

and

So we discovered we love Olive as a girls name, but again stuck on a middle name.

If you don’t have specific plans for the middle name, it’s a good place for an honor name: a family member, a family surname, your maiden name, a musician or author you admire, a place of significance.

Other possibilities:

Rhys Darwin Kelly
Rhys Desmond Kelly
Rhys Edmund Kelly
Rhys Everett Kelly
Rhys Ezra Kelly
Rhys Frederick Kelly
Rhys Gabriel Kelly
Rhys Hugo Kelly
Rhys Liam Kelly
Rhys Merrit Kelly
Rhys Milo Kelly
Rhys Matthias Kelly
Rhys Turner Kelly
Rhys Walker Kelly
Rhys Warren Kelly
Rhys Wilson Kelly

Olive Bianca Kelly
Olive Cordelia Kelly
Olive Francesca Kelly
Olive Geneva Kelly
Olive Harlow Kelly
Olive Jane Kelly
Olive Josephine Kelly
Olive Leticia Kelly
Olive Linnea Kelly
Olive Louisa Kelly
Olive Margot Kelly
Olive Mattea Kelly
Olive Melina Kelly
Olive Minerva Kelly
Olive Noelle Kelly
Olive Padgett Kelly
Olive Sabrina Kelly
Olive Silvia Kelly
Olive Simone Kelly
Olive Sterling Kelly
Olive Winifred Kelly
Olive Winslow Kelly

Name update! Alison writes:

Hi!

Wanted to send you an update on our name choice. We ended up having a boy, and named him Rhys Gibson Kelly. Gibson seemed to be the winning name amongst our choices, regardless of the musical tie. We love the fact that after we named him Rhys Gibson, his name can be known to mean “Enthusiastic, Laughing” which makes me all warm inside. And so far, Rhys Gibson lives up to his name in every way.

Thanks for your help!

Baby Boy Like-Miller-with-a-B, Brother to Callum Daniel

12 Replies

Kimberly writes:

We are expecting our second child, another boy, in early May! Our older son’s name is Callum Daniel. In an earlier post, you suggested Callum and Liam for twin boys’ names, and I’m wondering if you could please poll your readers to get their opinion on whether Callum and Liam sound too similar in a sibling set. Your opinion, of course, is much appreciated as well! Other first names under serious consideration are Andrew and Aiden (very popular in our region); the middle name is undecided but of less concern. Our naming guidelines are:

· No beginning or ending in B

· No names that are things (our surname is a thing)

· No two-syllable names that end in “er” (too sing-songy with our last name)

We had planned to use Amelia for a girl, and we are undecided on whether we will have more children.

If you choose to publish my question and need to use a substituted last name, I recommend “sounds like Miller with a B.”

Though I spend a lot of time lurking, I really appreciate your down-to-earth advice on naming and parenting in general!

Thank you,

I think my vote is that Callum and Liam are a little too close, but not deal-breakingly close: that is, if you love both names and decide to use them, there are plenty of sibling sets where the names are a little more similar than would be ideal (or even quite a bit more similar than would be ideal) but it’s completely fine and not enough reason to give up a favorite name.

A name I love with Callum is Declan. They share some sounds, so perhaps they too are too similar, but they sound more different to my ear.

If you love Aidan but find it too popular in your area, I wonder if you’d like Aidric? I’m surprised it isn’t more common.

Eamon would also fit very well. I recommend it second to Aidric because Aidric seemed easy to pronounce/spell even the first time I heard of it, but I’ve had to learn that Eamon is AY-mon (as opposed to EE-mon) and I still have to think about it.

I heard a little boy addressed as Garrett the other day, and it struck me that that’s another name I could stand to hear more often.

Oh, Griffin! I like Griffin even more! Callum and Griffin; Cal and Finn! A griffin is sort of a thing, though. I say “sort of” because I”m not sure what percentage of the population is familiar with that (almost everyone? only certain segments?), and I also wonder if the name is established enough that the connection to the thing doesn’t spring readily to mind; and because I think of the thing as being spelled gryphon (because of, I think, ONE book I read with a gryphon in it).

Well, if Griffin is out for thingness, I think I like Keegan even better anyway. It means two names starting with the same sound; would that make you feel stuck with a third child, if you had one? Callum and Keegan. I love that.

Enough chit-chat; let’s have that poll about Callum/Liam over to the right! [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results for “What do you think of Callum and Liam as brother names?” (358 votes total):

Too similar to use – 94 votes (26%)
A little too similar, but fine to use – 158 votes (44%)
Not too similar – 99 votes (28%)
Can’t decide – 7 votes (2%)

Name update! Kimberly writes:

Our family proudly welcomed Keegan Andrew on May 3! We are smitten! Thank you for helping us name our chunky monkey (he was 9 lbs, 15 oz at birth)!

Baby Girl K., Sister to Emma Mae

22 Replies

R. writes:

Our baby girl is due Feb. 13, 2012. Last name starts with a K. We are looking for a name that will sound good with Emma Mae – that’s our first daughter who will be 15 months old when the new baby is born. I always wanted an Emma because of the Jane Austen novels and I like traditional/old fashioned names but nothing that is so old we’d be the first people to use the name in like 50 years. I’ve always loved Abigail, but we know too many Abby’s personally. I also like Mona but my husband doesn’t.

Some of our names we are going back and forth on are:

1st Choice currently – Evelyn Ann (Ann is my mother in law’s middle name) (Mae is my mom’s middle name) I like names that I can shorten to a nickname like this would be Evie Ann…I call our daughter Emmie Mae

Caroline or Carolina

Kaitlyn Ann — would probably be called Katie Ann (This is my husband’s choice, I don’t like how it sounds with Emma personally)

If we ever have a boy our first choice would be Noah Michael, and we also like Joshua Allan, and Lucas Scott. So we’d like our baby girl’s name to sound good with those boy names as well. We’d like to have 4 kids.

Suggestions?

From your lists, Kaitlyn is the one that stands out to me as not fitting in with the others—either with the other girl names or with the potential future boy names. A name like Katherine would give you the nickname Katie, while keeping your name list in the old-fashioned/traditional theme. Or Kate is also a good stand-alone name, although then it doesn’t sound right with the middle name.

Emmie and Evie seem too similar to me, but maybe they wouldn’t be. I’m trying them aloud and can’t decide.

It’s too bad Abigail is out, because it seems to me like an excellent sister set with Emma. Do you like Gabrielle instead, with Gabby instead of Abby?

Or Annabel? It shares some of the sounds of Abigail, and I think it’s so sweet with Emma. Emma and Annabel. It messes up your middle name choice, though.

I love Sadie with Emma, too, or Sophie, or Lucy, or Molly. Maybe Sophia, and have Emma/Sophia and Emmie/Sophie.

The Baby Name Wizard suggests Grace, Lily, Julia, Isabel, and Chloe. I especially like Lily, or maybe Lillian. Emma and Lillian; Emmie Mae and Lily Ann.

If you love Jane Austen, I suggest Jane. It’s old fashioned, traditional, and underused but not at all unfamiliar. Emma and Jane is almost too wonderful. But as with Kate, it’s choppy with the middle name.

I wonder if you’d like Charlotte. Emma and Charlotte; Emmie Mae and Lottie Ann.

Baby Name to Consider: Bretcher

15 Replies

Amy writes:

This past Thanksgiving my brother-in-law was talking about my other brother in law and said “Well, Brett sure does.” Brett, who is only ten, quickly responded with “Who’s Bretcher?” The fact that Brett thought Bretcher sounded like a legitimate name got me thinking that it really does have a lot of the characteristics current, trendy boys names. It is an English surname, starts with the ever-popular Br sound, has an easy nickname in “Bret”, and as a bonus, it rhymes with Fletcher. What do you think?

I think you’re right: it has a lot going for it, name-candidate-wise. It FEELS like a name.

Going against it is the way it calls to mind the words wretch and retch.

What does everyone else think? Let’s have a poll over to the right. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results for the question “What do you think of the name Bretcher?” (457 votes total):

I love it! I’d want to use it! – 0 votes (0%)
I like it! I’d want to consider it! – 8 votes (2%)
I like it for someone else’s baby – 27 votes (6%)
No particular opinion either way – 19 votes (4%)
Slight dislike – 133 votes (29%)
Strong dislike – 270 votes (59%)

Baby Naming Issue: Preferences vs. Requirements

38 Replies

Julia writes:

We have three boys and are expecting our fourth child, a girl, in early March. My name is Julia, my husband is Greg, and our surname is Holloway.

Our boys are Leo Sebastian (7), Asher Hugo (5), and Simon Frederick (2). We consider ourselves pros at naming boys. My husband and I are equal partners in the naming process and really enjoyed it with our sons. We absolutely adore their names and think we did a pretty damn good job with them. But we’re starting to doubt our naming prowess with our daughter.

The problem is that we suck at naming girls. This is our first girl, and probably our last (we aren’t sure if we want another child after this one), so we want her name to be absolutely perfect. If this baby was a boy he would have been Jude Atticus or Felix Alasdair, depending on what he looked like. Done deal, give me the birth certificate so I can sign it already. But this wee lass is a giant pain as we are absolutely stumped on her name.

I suppose the problem is that we’re very conscientious about names. Like, we really like Ivy (it’s honestly the only one we’ve found that we like), but discarded it because of the long “i” sound it shares with Simon’s name. We don’t want her name to begin or end the same as any of our sons’ names and we don’t want any of the same dominant sounds. And this rules out a lot of names.

We also don’t want a name with an easy nickname, nor a name above two syllables.

Also we would like her name to end in a vowel, though it’s not mandatory.

We know that we want her name to be feminine but not frilly, soft but strong, elegant yet playful. Does it even exist? Are we being way too picky?

We did look at the meanings for our sons’ names when choosing them (Leo means “lion”, Asher means “lucky/happy one”, and Simon means “the listener”) and while it’s not TERRIBLY important we would like the meaning to be at least nice, if not wonderful.

Thank you, Swistle!

You are just as good at naming girls as you are at naming boys. The problem you’re encountering is that you’re setting up unnecessary requirements. “Not sharing a vowel sound with any siblings” is too strict when combined with “no more than two syllables,” “no nicknames,” “no sharing either beginning or ending sounds with a sibling,” and “having four children.”

It’s important when choosing a baby’s name to note the differences between requirements and preferences. A requirement might be something like “not creating a silly phrase with our surname.” A preference might be something like “not starting with the same initial as a sibling name.” Of course it will vary from situation to situation: in some families, different initials might be the requirement and making a silly phrase might be a goal. The main difference is that requirements must be VERY FEW, or else they create a logic puzzle that not one single name in the universe can satisfy. Preferences, on the other hand, may come in the form of long lists, because it is understood that any of them can be abandoned if a name meets most of them, or if a name is wonderful enough to be worth ditching them.

The first step, then, is to divide your long list of requirements into two lists, one of actual requirements, and one of preferences. With two or three children, I think it might be reasonable to want not to share any beginning sounds, any ending sounds, any dominant sounds, or any vowel sounds. With four children, I think it’s time to re-evaluate that for actual importance. A family of Leo, Asher, Simon, and Ivy does not make me think “OMG, they repeated the long-I sound!! Don’t they realize their children are INDIVIDUALS??” On the contrary, I’d think what a good job the family had done finding such completely different names that nevertheless went together well.

One way to separate out the requirements from the preferences is to ask yourself whether you think the rule is more important than the name—that is, whether you should dismiss a name you agree on and love, just because you’ve made an arbitrary rule and now the name doesn’t meet it. Which is more important, the name or the rule you made? If you reluctantly say that the rule is more important (as you might if your surname were Dover and your favorite name were Ben), then what you have is a requirement. If you think, “Wait. No, that would be silly: if the name of our dreams, the name we can’t bear not to use, is a name that has three syllables even though we said it couldn’t have more than two, we don’t actually have to let that rule boss us around,” then what you have is a preference.

Preferences can be a helpful tool for sorting through enormous piles of names. And it’s very satisfying to find a name that meets most or all of the preferences, which you might still do. But when preferences start running the show or making you feel frantic, or when every name you like is at the mercy of the preferences, that means the preference list is now the unreasonable boss rather than the helpful tool. You’re the one setting the standards for what qualifies as perfection, so you are also the ones who can re-set those standards.

It sounds to me like the name you’re looking for is Ivy. It doesn’t have more than two syllables. It doesn’t have an easy nickname. It ends in a vowel. It’s feminine but not frilly. It’s soft but strong. It’s elegant but playful. It’s wonderful with your surname, and with the sibling names. Eliminating it because it shares a single sound with a brother’s name is not conscientiousness, it’s pickiness. (And the name Felix would have repeated not only the long-E but also the only consonant sound of Leo.)

Now, if you don’t love the name Ivy, that’s a different story. In that case, we still need the section about requirements vs. preferences, but you also need name suggestions.

My first suggestion is Clara. It doesn’t share the first or last sounds of any brother names. It’s feminine, non-frilly, soft, strong, elegant, playful. It’s not as good with your surname as Ivy, but it’s still good: Clara Holloway. I suggest Felicity as the middle name, unless that would eliminate Felix for a future baby. Clara Felicity Holloway.

My second suggestion is Rose. It’s gotten common as a middle name, but is still surprising and fresh as a first name, while also sounding classic and traditional: a very nice combination. Rose Holloway is wonderful. Leo, Asher, Simon, and Rose. I suggest Eliza as the middle name to emphasize the Z sound of both names: Rose Eliza Holloway.

My third suggestion is Phoebe. Elegant but playful. Two syllables. Ends in a vowel. Great with the brother names. Etc. I suggest the middle name Louise: Phoebe Louise Holloway.

My fourth suggestion is Beatrix. It has three syllables, or maybe more like 2.5, and it doesn’t end in a vowel—but I reject those preferences in favor of this name. Talk about elegant but playful! Talk about feminine but non-frilly! BEATRIX, baby. It’s similar to your boy name choice Felix, but without being as similar to Leo. I suggest the middle name Philippa: Beatrix Philippa Holloway.

My fifth suggestion is Greta. Look at how gorgeous it is with your surname. (I like Margaret even better, but that has tons of established nicknames.) I suggest Magnolia as the middle name: Greta Magnolia Holloway.

I think I’ll stop counting my suggestions. Next up is Meredith. Three syllables, true; if that turns out to be one of the truly important requirements, then never mind. But man, what a great name with your surname and with the brother names. Leo, Asher, Simon, and Meredith! Meredith Holloway! Maybe put Ivy as the middle name, if it turns out not to work as a first name: Meredith Ivy Holloway.

Next is Ruth. Ruthie springs to mind as a nickname, but I love it with the brother names. Leo, Asher, Simon, and Ruth. A much more serious spin on the group than something like Phoebe, though. I’d put something light and feminine as the middle name; maybe Clarissa. Ruth Clarissa Holloway.

To maintain a lighter touch, maybe Ruby: Leo, Asher, Simon, and Ruby.

Ruby would make me think of Lucy, but I suspect that won’t fly with Leo. But Lucy makes me think of Darcy, which I think fits better anyway: Leo, Asher, Simon, and Darcy.

Name update! Julia writes:

So um I just had the baby eight hours ago but I’m so excited about her name I just had to give you an update!

We went to the hospital with three names: Phoebe Juniper, Clara Beatrix, and Eloise Ivy (which was a miracle in itself seeing that when I first begged you for help we had absolutely nothing). We loved them all equally and had no idea how we were going to pick. Like, I was expecting the decision of her name to be harder than actually giving birth to her.

But. When I held her the first thing I noticed is that she had this little scrunched-up look on her face and when our son Leo held her for the first time she punched him in the nose; our three-year-old Simon didn’t want to hold her after she pinned him with a tough glare. So her personality helped us narrow down the names. She wasn’t a sunny, sweet Phoebe. She wasn’t a soft, playful Eloise. This baby was a no-nonsense, I-may-be-a-only-a-few-hours-old-but-I-am-already-the-boss-of-all-of-you Clara Beatrix.

We’re all doing great and HOLY MOTHER we named our daughter a name we actually adore to pieces. Thank you, Swistle! It was your suggestions of Clara and Beatrix that made the names click with us. And the preferences vs requirements post for us was extremely helpful. So thanks again!

Anyway, I’m sorry if I’m insensible. I just needed to share my happiness about Clara’s name and couldn’t wait!

Baby Name to Consider: Willoughby

49 Replies

Rachael writes:

We are expecting our second baby in June! Our first is sweet Sylvia and I emailed you about why we chose to keep her name a secret until she was born in 2010. Loooong before Sylvia was born, my husband and I had settled on a girl name and a boy name that we both adored and loved and swore to always stand behind. No one has ever complained about Sylvia’s name, especially since we kept it a secret. But with our boy name, I am much less confident, and alas – I’m stuck in this ancient and sacred promise I made to my husband.

He loves the name Willoughby.

We discussed this name after a few short months of dating and from the moment he mentioned it, I fell madly in love with it, too! It sounds British and sophisticated when I picture a grown up man, yet soft and cute for a cuddly baby boy. We agreed that he could have Willoughby for the first boy if I could have Sylvia for the first girl and that was all fine and good until I got pregnant and…now I’m afraid! I know my family will think it’s weird. I’m not against anyone calling him Will if they really have to, but I think Willoughby goes so well with Sylvia and I hate how “Sylvia and Will” sound together. I’ll be referring to my kids as “Sylvia and Willoughby – cutest siblings ever.” I also know my family will think it’s too long (our last name is four syllables, very Italian, ends in “iotto”). I know they’ll say it’s a terrible name and I’m afraid everyone will hate it!

Should that matter? I still love it – I can’t find any other name I like more than this one. My husband would be devastated if I even mentioned another name to him, but this case of cold feet has me worried to pieces! Talk me down, Swistle. Tell me this name is perfectly okay!

Willoughby is definitely in a different league, surprise-wise. It’s not even in the Social Security database for boys in 2010 (which means it could have been given to 0, 1, 2, 3, or 4 boys, but not as many as 5) (it was given to 6 girls), whereas Sylvia was #555.

I’m picturing it on grown men I know (my husband, my brother, my dad, my friends) and it is a little startle every time—in a way that another modern not-their-name such as Wilson is not. If I picture it on a cute little toddler or an elementary school child, it seems adorable.

The girl name Willow is an issue here: it gives a misleading clue. Ditto for girl names such as Shelby and Abby and Ruby and Libby and Gabby. On the other side of the scale is the common boy nickname Will and the -by ending boy names Colby and Bobby and Toby.

Length doesn’t seem like it should be a concern, if they didn’t object to Sylvia: both names have three syllables.

Whether everyone else’s opinion should matter or not—well, it depends. On one hand, no, right? Parents get to name their own children. And it’s classic for the grandparent generation to grouse about the names currently being used for babies: “Too weird! Why can’t people use NORMAL names like the names WE used for OUR babies (which OUR parents thought were too weird)?” And of course there will always be some people who dislike the names we choose, no matter WHAT names those are. And it’s also classic for people to come around to the names once they get used to it on the beloved baby.

On the other hand, this is why naming is such a huge responsibility: our children have to live in this society with the names we give them, and it’s a hard row to hoe to live with a name everybody hates. And within our families and friend circles, of course we WANT people to respond favorably to the name, rather than cringing every time they say it.

So it’s a matter of balance: weighing what we think society/family/friends will think of the name with what WE think of the name. This is one reason I like The Baby Name Wizard‘s test so much: she suggests considering whether you would like to be a child born now and given that name. I also like the test of looking around at grown-ups and imagining them with the name. And of course there’s the careers test: imagine the name on a manager, a waiter, a coach, a lawyer, a teacher, a carpenter.

If a name fails too many tests, I think the middle name slot is an excellent place for it: there is still the happiness of using it, but without the downsides.

Promises to use a particular name shouldn’t be made, or honored. Too much changes between the time the promise is made and the appearance of the actual baby. If you decide you’re not comfortable using Willoughby (and I could be wrong about your feelings: I’m basing it on “alas” and “stuck,” but the more important words could be “madly in love” and “afraid” and “cold feet”), it will be disappointing to your husband, but it’s not something you have to feel contractually obligated to follow through on. My main advice for back-to-the-drawing-board situations is that the task is not to find a name the two of you like better than the name Willoughby, but rather to find your favorite from the names that remain. And also that both parents are responsible for finding the new options: this is not a matter of one parent needing to convince the other to dethrone a favorite.

Let’s have a poll over to the right to see what everyone else thinks of the name Willoughby. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Poll results for the question “What do you think of the name Willoughby?” (519 votes total):

I love it! I’d want to use it! – 39 votes (8%)
I like it! I’d consider it! – 58 votes (11%)
I like it for someone else’s baby – 161 votes (31%)
No particular opinion either way – 21 votes (4%)
Slight dislike – 136 votes (26%)
Strong dislike – 104 votes (20%)

Baby Boy Harris, Brother to Abig@il Elizabeth: Family Member Doesn’t Want a Namesake

22 Replies

L. writes:

My husband and I had the perfect name picked out for our son who is due in early March, but our plan has fallen apart. We were going to name him after his two grandfathers Leon@rd (mine) James (his) and we were going to call him Leo. Even though we had told no one our name, this week my father made sure to let me know in no uncertain terms that he would never forgive me if I named this baby after him. Needless to say, I am heartbroken.

So, back to the drawing board we go. If this baby had been a girl, she would have been Eleanor (nickname Nora). I prefer older, traditional names (preferrably with a cute nickname). I also want to stay away from the top 10 names. (I would never have named Abby that if I’d realized at the time how popular her name was.) I do realize that Eleanor/Nora is also becoming more popular, but we love it for it’s family significance. Of the names in the top 50 from the Social Security list for 2010, the only one that even pops out as a possibility is Isaac.

Things that are important to me for the name is that it have at least 2 syllables and not end in an S. (I like Charles, but Charles James Harris is a little much.)

One name that I like, but am unsure I could pull the trigger on if if my husband would agree, is Oswald. Help!

I feel like we need more information from your father. Why would he say such a thing? When he said it, did you ask what his reason was? I’m kind of looking forward to after the baby is born, when you can tell him that you WERE going to name the baby after him but then he screwed everything up. That was a GREAT NAME you’d chosen.

Leo and Charles were two of our top contenders for Henry, so I wonder if you’d like Oliver, also on our list. Oliver James Harris; Abigail and Oliver.

Another from that list was Elliot. Elliot James Harris; Abigail and Elliot.

Another from that list was Milo. Milo James Harris; Abigail and Milo.

I’d recommend Henry, too, if you like alliteration.

A name that shot to the top of my list after Henry was born is Simon. Simon James Harris; Abigail and Simon.

Another is Everett. I think it’s so handsome with your surname. Everett James Harris; Abigail and Everett.

I do love the name Isaac, if you want to consider it more. Nicknames could be Ike or Zack. Isaac James Harris; Abigail and Isaac; Abby and Zack.

I know a sibling set of Abigail and Owen, and I’ve thought of it as a very good combination. Owen James Harris; Abigail and Owen.

Are there any other men from your side of the family who would make good namesakes? Maybe one of your grandfathers or uncles? It’s so disappointing to have a good namesake name all set to go and then have it ruined!

Name update! L. writes:

I just wanted to let you and your readers know that our son was born on March 1, 2012. I took a step back from the naming dilemma for a while and let the situation (and my hormones) settle down a bit, but I did eventually have a conversation about the name with my Dad. He was a little embarrassed that he had reacted so strongly, but it turns out that he never liked his name because of some unwelcome nicknaming that went along with it. He was both surprised and flattered that we planned to name our son after him. Here is a picture of our newest edition, Leonard James. Thanks so much for your help. I appreciate you and your readers being the voice of reason for me.