Dear Swistle,
I’ve been a reader for a long time, and 3ish years ago you had a “quick answers in the comments” post that helped us name our daughter (Cor@ H@zel). We are now expecting another daughter (almost certainly our last child) in October, and are really struggling with her name.We went into the delivery room with two names when Cora was born, and we still really liked the name we didn’t end up using, which was Margaret. But my husband’s cousin used the name for his daughter about 6 months ago, and we just felt weird about using it.
(As an aside, not only did they use the first name we had picked out, they also used the dated, relatively obscure middle name that we were going to use…it’s my middle name with some history on my mom’s side, so totally unexpected for my husband’s cousin to use it! We hadn’t shared our name choices with anyone, so we were flabbergasted when they announced her name).
We brainstormed a new list of names, but we are having a really hard time getting to a consensus. We even put Margaret back on the list (they exclusively call their Margaret by a nickname we would never use, so it feels less weird. We would call her Margaret or maybe Margo, and pick a different middle), but now my husband is having second thoughts about it. He has trouble spelling it (which I argued he would get used to once he wrote her name down a few times while filling out paperwork) and isn’t sure about how the middle syllable gets smooshed. Also I recently found out that was my grandpa’s most hated aunt’s name, which, while that doesn’t really matter, doesn’t give me *good* vibes.
Our last name is Dutch. It sounds like Anderson but with a “V” stuck on the front, and the emphasis is on the “der”.
Our “naming rules” are that it should be pronounceable upon seeing and spell-able upon hearing. We did break that rule with Cora, and it hasn’t been a problem, so I guess that’s more of a naming “guideline”. We tend to like shorter names because our last name is a mouthful, and we don’t like unisex names.
Here’s the list we’ve come up with. We both like all of these names enough to use them, theoretically, but disagree on which one would be best. Or second best. Or 3rd best etc.
Alice (some family baggage, but surmountable if we love it best)
Margaret (after all the drama it feels a little anticlimactic to go back, but I still love it)
Willa (husband’s grandma, worried about constantly being mistaken for Willow?)
Violet (husband doesn’t like how the middle syllable is swallowed up, and I’m not sure how I feel about the alliteration)
Grace (I think it’s a little boring/dated)
Mabel (Mae is a family name for me, it just might be a little too Old Lady Chic? It’s quite a bit less popular than Cora)
Iris (I love, husband wishy washy. He likes it when he thinks flower, but not eyeball)
Ada (husband likes, I’m wishy washy)
Margot (my first choice when Margaret got axed, husband also loves it but he hates the “t”…it makes his brain go Mar-Got, but we think we might be dooming her to a life of constant irritation if we used an alternate spelling, since the t spelling is pretty dominant?)
Molly (It doesn’t feel substantial enough to me but husband likes it)
Ivy (we both love but it sounds bad with our last name)
For middle names our preference is “names we like with a family connection”, even if that connection is tenuous or only in our heads. Current options include Elise (a mashup of our moms’ middles-Lee and Denise) or Elizabeth (after husband’s grandma Betty). But we aren’t that fussed and will cross that bridge once we pick a first name!
Help! I don’t know if what we need is a name we haven’t thought of, or for someone in authority to tell us which problems we are wondering about are or are not real. We are in the middle of an international move (Americans moving back from abroad), with a toddler, in a pandemic, so I’m willing to accept that excess stress might be leading me to create problems where none exist!
Thanks,
David and Samantha
I still love Margaret for this baby, and I think it’s lovely with the sibling name and surname. Issues I am declaring Not Real: it was the name of your grandfather’s most hated aunt; your husband currently has trouble spelling it (I have utter faith in his ability to improve with patience and practice!).
I also love Alice. Cora and Alice! Gorgeous. Is the s-sound in Alice at all odd with the s-sound in the surname, or is it a nice tie-in? I can’t quite tell.
I think Willa is another great option. I doubt it would be confused with Willow at a level that might rule out using it, though I’d be grateful for input from people who know/have/are a Willa. And so many names are briefly/occasionally confused with other names, and it seems like it’s not a big deal unless it’s a virtually unheard of name that is CONSTANTLY confused with a much more familiar name, which is not the case here. And so I declare that issue Not Real—UNLESS it would make you clench your teeth with intense irritation every time it was confused with Willow, in which case I declare it Real—though, even then, perhaps more an issue of thinking of ways to prevent the confusion, such as exaggerating the articulation the first time, or immediately spelling it, or saying “Willa: like Will but with an A on the end.”
I am picky about alliteration, and I am in favor of Violet with your surname. I don’t mind the “swallowed middle syllable” issue, though I do see it; this seems like another fairly common name situation. Like, if your husband ONLY likes the name pronounced Vi-o-let, and it will drive him crazy to hear Vi-let, then that is a genuinely good reason not to use it. But if this is more a theoretical thing, where he likes Vi-o-let AND Vi-let but is bothered in principle by the fact that in language we sometimes smooth/elide, then that seems like another Not Real issue.
I think Mabel is delightful with Cora. I think this is a good example of a pairing where each name makes me like the other name even more.
Margo(t) is another good option, and I see no reason at all to use the T version if you’d prefer it without: both spellings are familiar. You are correct that with the T is currently more common, but the one without the T used to be dominant. I think it’s only an issue if it would bug you to sometimes need to correct someone’s spelling. My own name has various spellings, and it doesn’t feel like a big deal to have to either pre-load the correct spelling (“Kristen; that’s K-r-i-s-t-E-n”) or else correct it when necessary (“Oh—it’s Kristen with a K”). It doesn’t feel like being doomed to a lifetime of constant irritation. And TONS of names have alternate spellings, so it feels like another pretty common naming thing.
I have said it aloud many times and am not confident enough to try to pressure you about it—but actually I REALLY LIKE Ivy with your surname. I think it’s distinctive in a good way. I could see how it might feel like it could run together a little—but I think you’d quickly get used to putting a teensy little pause in there, like “Ivy.V____.” And I adore it with Cora. But of course such things are hugely subjective: if you don’t like the sound of Ivy with your surname, that’s what matters. (I’m hoping other commenters will try it out and then weigh in.) (And side with me.) (Because I love it more and more.)
More names to consider:
Beatrice
Beatrix
Eliza
Frances
Gemma
Greta (unless this is the nickname for Margaret the cousin is using)
Harriet
Ida
Isla
Louise
Lydia
Jane
Jean
Pearl
Polly
Rose
Stella
Sylvia
Name update:
Hi Swistle!
Our daughter arrived last week and was nameless for 2 days. Pre-delivery we had narrowed down our long list to two (Margo Elise or Ivy Elizabeth) and intended to choose one upon meeting her. But when we held her, neither felt right, so we went back to the longer list and decided that her name is Violet Elise!
Thank you so much for your help and advice. It was really freeing to hear that you liked the way Ivy sounded with our last name…we had taken a lot of names off the list that clashed, but couldn’t ever get rid of Ivy. ( I think part of the reason we didn’t use Ivy is that Violet spent a few days in the NICU and all the talk about her IV subconsciously soured me on it. If we were ever to have another girl we’d definitely put it back on the list).
Thanks again,
Samantha and David
I came to suggest Willa, and was so SO pleased to see it on your list. It’s pronounceable, it’s spellable, it’s uncommon but not unheard of, and it’s great with Cora.
I also love Ivy as a sister to Cora and I agree with Swistle that it sounds good with your last name.
My brother has the same name as our cousin, my mom asked my aunt if it was okay to use it beforehand and it’s never caused an issue, they even go by the same nickname. Maybe you could ask your husband’s cousin if it bothers them and proceed from there on Margaret.
Of Swistle’s suggestions, I LOVE Pearl. Blair and Olive also came to mind.
Good luck!
I love Violet for you. The alliteration is wonderful- plus what fun initials.
Margo is also lovely – no need for a T if you don’t want it. I know a Margaux who I’m sure spells her name often but she loves her name. If you like Margo, how about Monica? My great aunt is called Margo short for Marigold.
Oh my goodness, Cora Hazel is perfection! Before I saw your options I thought of Willa as the perfect sister name for Cora. I also like Nina, Sylvie, and Gwendolen/Gwendolyn for you:
Willa Margaux
Sylvie Margot/Margaux/Margo
Sylvie Pearl (shares the same meaning as Margaret)
Nina Constance
Nina Pearl
Gwendolen Margot
Greta Leann
Greta Mabel
Greta Belle
Gwendolyn Pearl
Mabel Aurelia
Mabel August
Edith Margot or Edith Margaret
I love Frances from Swistle’s suggestions soooo much. I also like Margaret/Margo(t) from your list, and generally think that all of your options are great! Good luck with the move
We must be name twins; my name list looks very similar to yours! I have a Willa. In the first couple hours, a doctor and a nurse thought I said Willow. I freaked out a bit, but quickly learned to really enunciate the ending sound when introducing her. Since then I’ve only had a handful of people. I’m a librarian, so I also sometimes add “like Willa Cather, the author” to help people remember. It’s pretty much a non-issue. I also love Mabel, Greta, Mae (this is my oldest child’s middle name and it is simply lovely and I think it’d be a first name that could spark a lot of joy – especially since it’s usually used as a middle name), Eliza, Iris, and Violet.
I suggest Heidi.
And your middle name as the baby’s middle! I don’t think using the same middle your cousin chose is an issue, especially since it’s your own middle name!
Cora and Heidi!
I absolutely love Ivy with your last name (swoon!) I think you should reconsider! ;) While reading, my first thought was to suggest Lydia…but Ivy is so perfect!
IMO, “Grandpa’s most hated aunt” can count if she beat the living tar out of him, esp if Grandpa’s still alive. Or if you knew her and disliked her too, which doesn’t apply here. MIL, DH, and I would all take some time to handle it if one of our kids decided to use MIL’s mother’s name. She was mean-spirited at best and abusive at worst well into DH’s childhood. She mellowed under the influence of her last husband, but even when I knew her, she was …not someone I’d want to name a child after…
Margaret might still be usable, though, even with a 1st cousin once removed and your mean great-great aunt. Especially if she quickly acquires a nickname like Margo or even Molly.
Other than that, I generally agree with Swistle
I have a Willa, who often gets mistaken for Willow and I usually just assume I have to speak more clearly when that happens.
On the other hand my son’s name is Ansel and he frequently gets called Hansel and that does annoy me. I think it’s my inner pretentious snob wondering why Ansel Adams is not more well known.
So… *shrug*
I vote Mae Elizabeth! Spunky, significant, and Cora and Mae sound great together. Good luck!
My Willa is 5, and I too worried that it would be constantly confused with Willow. It has happened a handful of times, but not nearly as much as I worried, and not enough to be a real inconvenience. The name wears BEAUTIFULLY, and I am endlessly happy we chose it for our firstborn. Two thumbs up, highly recommend!
Cora & Mabel sound absolutely delightful together. Sweet sisters, happily playing in the garden is what I see!
Cora Hazel & Mabel Elise… just divine!
Irene! Like Iris, but no eyeball connection, and like Ivy, but no repeating Vs, and like Alice, but no family baggage (hopefully).
Or maybe Mary?
Oh also…Ivy Van _____ sounds perfectly fine. And I have a May and nobody ever says, “What an unusual name!!!” so I wouldn’t worry about it being less common than Cora.
If not Alice, why not Elise as first name?
Elise hits the right notes, is a positive association (x2), and is high on your list.
Elise Margaret- then still have the joy of Margaret as her middle.
I love Willa with Cora, I like Willa Elise, Willa Elizabeth.
I also like Elise as a first name but if that’s no, I think Margo Elise sounds lovely.
Ohmygosh, please please name her Margaret and call her Pearl for short. It’s an old and pretty archaic nickname/diminutive/pet name for it, but oh man it is soooo cute and a) Cora and Pearl (chef’s kiss) and B Pearl (Van)DERson has just the right level of rhymey flow to be adorable.
Otherwise I would also have suggested Ida if you have Ivy and Ada on the list.
I agree wholeheartedly with everything Swistle said. Your choices are ALL excellent. You can’t go wrong.
To me, Margot seems like the best “compromise” name, if you keep feeling squicky about using Margaret. I also think Ida (one of Swistle’s suggestions) is a good mid-way point between Iris and Ada.
I also LOVE Irene, as another commenter suggested.
Or maybe Vera? Sounds snappy and distinctive, to me, with the last name. But maybe you wouldn’t like the repeated “ra” with Cora.
Or what about Alma?
I have a friend who chose Ivy but considered Iris (like you) and Lily. Cora and Lily?
Also, what about Mary Mae nn Molly? I love names like Jane and Mary that seem common and plain on the surface but are actually so sophisticated and fresh sounding because they aren’t often used as first names. (Or would Mary and Cora be too Downton Abbey? I don’t know.)
Personally, I think Margaret is out for you. There are just too many knocks against it at this point. But I do think Margo (no T) is a great alternative and it sounds like you both really like it. Plus I like the o tie-in with both girls. Cora and Margo.
I think you’ve knocked it out of the park with Margo Elise. That’s flawless to me. Cora Hazel & Margo Elise. Gorgeous.
I had Margot and Cora on my list, so we are maybe girl name friends. I also had Irene, Rose, Simona, Miriam, and Marin on my list (and then had boys). Do you like any of these?
What about Viola? It doesn’t seem to have the same issue as Violet in terms of the middle syllable. I do like the alliteration.
Iris is a a favorite of my and goes well with Cora and your last name.
I’m partial to Ada because of Ada Lovelace but it may be too close to the very popular Ava.
I am not sure about Ivy with your last name but Eve seems great with it and fits well with your other criteria – easy to spell and say, short, and feminine. It avoids the alliteration issue and goes well with Cora.
I like Evelyn with the last name and you could call her Evie (Evvie or Ee-vie pronunciation if you prefer); My friend goes by Allie among friends but is formally introduced as Allison surname (sounds much better than Allie surname, although that is subjective).
Ivy Margaret is currently my front runner baby name for a yet to exist baby girl. I love it especially with your last name.
Also one of my friends is Margeaux and yes she always has to spell her name, but I (as a Carolyn) also always have to spell my name so it’s just a thing. Nbd.
I have a Cora–her older sister is Anna. Your list is very nice–probably time to do some weighted rankings with your husband? (Even just with tiers of 1/2/3 would probably cross some names and get you to a shortlist.)
I will throw out some names from my notes app since we both chose Cora:
Maya
Thea
Rosa
Gwen
Tess
Vera
Joan
Lucy
(those are from my specifically-four-letter list :) )
Catherine
Delia
Isabel
Marguerite (our runner-up for Cora)
Zoe
Abigail
Rosamund/Rosemary
Laurel
Gabrielle
Madeline
Leonie
Elizabeth
Winifred (“Winnie”)
Bryony
Justine
I love Willa Elise!!
Cora and Willa – awesome.
Congrats; tell us what you decide.
What about Fern?
It’s a really nice list. I agree with you on Molly, but otherwise I could see you using any of them.
My favorites are Alice, Grace, Margaret, & Violet.
Ruby – short like Cora – about the same popularity. Easy to spell and pronounce.
Zoey/Zoe – ZV make fun initials
Olive/Olivia/Livi – a lot of “v” sounds but in line with Ivy
Vera – again leaning into the “v” sound
Margo is just fine without the t. You, and eventually she, will have to say “Margo without a t” but that’s an easy enough clarification. Growing up, people often spelled my name “Gene” and I took to saying, “Jean, like pants” as a joke. People have to clarify spellings for all kinds of names and many people don’t care about names as much as those of us here and many more people are just awful spellers.
I also like Swistle’s suggestions of Sylvia and Frances. I feel like with Sylvia, that extra syllable between Vs helps it sound smooth and lovely rather than clunky.
Other thoughts, some that are echos of previous comments:
Cora and Nella
Cora and Lucy
Cora and Mae
Cora and Ruby
Cora and Eloise
Cora and Daphne
Cora and Alice are sisters in “The Last of the Mohicans” – to me it’s a plus ( I love the movie). I just thought I would point it out in case it’s an issue. I doubt many people would get the reference.
Such a beautiful name list! And Cora Hazel is a fantastic name.
With her name and your last name, I like these the most:
Mabel (not too old ladyish at all!)
Willa
Margo
Alice
Lucy
Stella
Jane
A lovely name – congrats on the arrival of Violet Elise and thanks for updating us all!
Swistle – this made me think that another ‘quick answers in the comments’ post might be a lot of fun?!