Hi Swistle! I can’t believe I FINALLY get to email you a baby name question. Hooray!

I’m Julia, husband is Niall. Baby Clover (nickname) is due 10/16/16. Surname is Faygan (spelled without the y).

So far we seem to be doing okay with naming discussions. Nobody has a hill to die on, YET. We don’t know the sex of the baby but we will find out in about 2 weeks (hopefully!!!), so it seems like we’re in a first name holding pattern until then– discussions are pretty hypothetical.

My surname is G0dl3y (but obviously spelled with letters instead of numbers). I haven’t legally changed my surname and I’m not sure if I’m going to, but I’ve adopted Faygan as my stage name. The baby will get Niall’s last name, even though mine is clearly better. He moved to California from Ireland away from his whole family and he’s putting down roots here and making it his home and having a family here, and oh fine the baby gets your last name.

Niall did agree to having G0dl3y be a middle name for this child and any others we may have. AND he also told me, and I quote, “The baby can have as many middle names as you want.”

I think he meant it as somewhat of a joke, because he doesn’t care about middle names, but I’m taking this and running with it. I have a whole list of potential middle names.

And this brings me to my question (finally)– How many middle names is too many?

To be clear, this is not an OPINION question. What I want to know is, logistically and legally speaking, what is the maximum number of middle names a person can have? I’ve tried to look it up online, but I keep getting suckered into message boards where people ask “can I give my baby three middle names?” and the responses vary from “Sure! Give you kid as many names as you want” to “What are you, BRITISH ROYALTY?” There seems to be some consensus that two middle names is good/great/fine, but three is COMPLETELY UNREASONABLE.
(Why, though? Who cares? How is it hurting you if someone’s child has two or zero or seven middle names? I like middle names. I think they’re decorative. But I digress.)

So, anyway. I’m not interested in reading a comment war about what a terrible mother I am if I saddle my child with four or five middle names. What I want to know is, CAN I? How big are the name spaces on the baby’s birth certificate? Where do I write multiple middle names? Do I have to do something extra in order to add extra names? I’m fine with doing that, but I’d rather know now than ask some harassed hospital personnel when I’m exhausted and post-childbirth. Is the child going to have to write ALL of his/her names on legal forms or can he/she choose a favorite and stick with that one for forms and keep the others for decoration?

Just for fun, here are some of the middle names I’ve got in mind:

Stoneburner- my grandmother’s maiden name. I used to think it would make an awesome first name for a boy, but after living in SF it just seems to give off too much of a stonery or pottheadsih vibe.

Amethyst- from one of my favorite books, The Ordinary Princess. I’ve always loved the name and it REMINDS me of my grandmother because the book makes me think of her.

Raffetto- My mother’s maiden name. I had thought about it as a first name for a boy, but I don’t love the nicknames Ralph or Raffy, so… nah.

David, John, Robert, Charles- Niall’s and my fathers’ and grandfathers’ names.

Jane, Frances, Kathleen, Maureen, Marie, Eve, Florence – Niall’s and my grandmothers’ and mothers’ first and middle names.

Clover- I actually like it as a first name, but it might be better as a middle name.

Rainbow- Niall said “Why don’t we just call the baby Clover?” as a joke and I perked up and said “Great! Sure!” and then he backpedaled. So then I jokingly suggested Rainbow, which I really do like.

Poppy- Very close to my heart as a Californian.

Athlone- Niall’s town in Ireland where he grew up.

Okay, so now just imagine for a moment wee baby boy __________ Stoneburner Charles Clover G0dl3y Faygan. Or little baby girl __________ Frances Florence Rainbow Kathleen G0dl3y Faygan. HOW ADORABLE IS THAT? (Very. It’s very adorable. Somebody come with me on this.)

Thank you for your help!!

Love,
Jules

So! I did not know the answer to this. And when I tried to find out the answer, I too got distracted by a bunch of comments sections filled with people saying what they THOUGHT was true, or thought SHOULD be true, rather than what they had reason to KNOW was true. Typically the comments section of a name blog is (and should be) filled with opinions, but what is needed here is a gear-change into FACTS. Here are the facts I have so far:

Birth certificates and their application forms vary by state. Each state has their own way of doing it. In my state, I was very annoyed to find that they could not print my full name on my children’s birth certificates, because they will print only one middle name in the field for parent name, and I have two. This drives me crazy. But anyway, here’s the baby name field for a baby born in California:

Not a whole lot of space. I think you could squeeze four middle names in there if you wrote small. After that, I think you’d have to ask for help from the person who assists parents with the form, and hope you got a helpful, experienced, problem-solving type of clerk instead of a stubborn, inflexible type of clerk. Some states have their forms available online, to be partially filled out ahead of time. This seems like a great idea if you want to practice writing tiny. Also, I vote that your husband be put in charge of being firm yet charming with any clerk who proves stubborn. Although I’ll add that exhausted postpartum crying can be a very effective technique.

Furthermore, I looked up images for “California birth certificate,” and it looks to me as if the printed certificate looks very similar to the application:

It looks to me as if the child’s legal birth certificate will not have room for multiple middle names. I don’t know what they’ll do instead. Maybe just print the first one? Maybe print as many letters as will fit in the field? But I think it’s likely that the birth certificate would not show all the middle names, which I find disappointing.

Here is the second fact, and this is the one that will be a little difficult for many of us to hear: according to the United States government, middle names are not part of a person’s legal name. This also applies to suffixes such as Jr., III, IV: they’re not part of the legal name, even though they’re permitted to appear on legal documents. You can put them wherever you want, but legally-speaking they’re only decorative. This means that the government takes no official stance on how many middle names your child may have. This is a little odd coming from an entity that cares what color pen you use to fill out the forms, but okay.

And it’s good news, in that it means you are not legally prevented from using four or five middle names. It’s also bad news, in that the government is not motivated to get it right or help you get it right. On the page I just linked to, it literally says that it does not matter if the middle name(s) or suffix(es) are incorrect or omitted on government forms and cards. It may matter to the bank, or it may matter to a particular government clerk who mistakenly thinks it matters, but it does not matter to the government itself.

So no, the child will not have to use all middle names on all forms, though he or she is very likely to regularly run into problems with people who think consistency IS required. Many forms allow for only one middle initial; I’d recommend picking one to consistently default to.

In the early stages of this research, while still bogged down in sites full of people saying what they THOUGHT about multiple middle names, I asked Paul to help me figure out how to figure this out. He found two interesting things to contribute:

1. One of Uma Thurman’s children has many middle names: Rosalind Arusha Arkadina Altalune Florence Thurman-Busson. So she must have found a way to fill out the form.

2. There’s also this gentleman, whose name is so long it is often written with an “etc.” in it.

Name update:

Hi Swistle!

I’ve been meaning to send this for ages, but things kind of got away from me.
“Baby Clover” was born on 10/14/16 after 43 hours of labor (oof). His name (are you ready for it?) is Tiernan Jack Stoneburner G0dl3y Faygan.
Niall and I had agreed on the first name Tiernan a couple of months before his birth, but managed to keep it a secret until he was born (we had to make SURE that was his name once we got a look at him on the outside). We wanted something Irish that wouldn’t be too terribly difficult to pronounce or spell.
Jack is for Niall’s middle name (John), his dad’s name (John), and his grandfather (Jack).
Stoneburner is my grandmother’s maiden name.
G0dl3y is my last name, but it is one of Tiernan’s middle names, not a surname.
In case you are wondering, ‘Jack Stoneburner G0dl3y’ represents the maximum number of middle name characters you can have on a birth certificate (in CA)! The lady doing our forms told us we would probably have to drop one of Tiernan’s middle names (which caused newly postpartum me to weep), but they all ended up juuuuuust fitting! Whew.

Thank you so much for all your help!

Jules

Hi Swistle,
I’ve been a fan of your site and baby naming style for a while now and I’m hoping you can help us out with this one.
We are having a baby girl in October. She will be joining 3 older brothers and will be our last child. Each time we were naming a boy I thought it would be so much easier to come up with a girl name, but it turns out it has been tremendously difficult for us. Maybe because we already have 3 boy names that it has to fit with.
We like classic names that are not too common, yet not unusual either. The boys names are Dean Samuel, Elliot Lewis, and Morgan Leonard (I call him Morgan Leo but my husband wouldn’t agree to Leo on paper, saying it wasn’t a real name on its own…)
We know the middle name will be Summer, after my sister, so I am looking at names that go with this. Our last name sounds like Iverson.
The girl name we had picked for our last 2 boys before we knew the gender was Nora Summer. We still love this name, however, it has entered the top 50 (41) since we picked it a few years ago (when it was not in the top 100). I’m worried that it is now too common and I don’t want to have other kids with the same name in school, etc, although I don’t personally know anyone with the name Nora. I also like it because my father is Arabic and he likes that it is similar to the name Noor.
Because of it’s popularity (which bothers me a decent amount and my husband not at all) we have been considering other names. I tend to like names that end with an “a” sound to go with Summer as a middle, but this isn’t a rule. My only rule is that I want to avoid repeating a first initial. Also, I was considering using an A name to honor my grandmother Agnes Anastasia.

Here is our list so far of names my husband and I both like:

Farrah – also good with my heritage but a little worried about some negative associations recently (Mtv show that I’ve fortunately never seen), also doesn’t seem classic enough with the other boy names.

Althea- probably my husbands favorite after Nora. I like Thea as a nickname (even as a name on its own but my husband does not)
I worry that it’s a little too unusual.

Ramona- I really like this name. It’s a little quirky, not too unusual, and still pretty. Everyone I’ve mentioned it to gives me a funny look or refers to the Beverly Cleary books.

Other names I like but probably wouldn’t use:
Leila (too common)
Iris (doesn’t go with last name)
Clara (husband says “I don’t hate it…”

Names I like that husband has vetoed:
Flora
Louisa
Astrid

If we were having another boy, he would be Arthur Clarke. Also like Harvey for a boy.

If you could help us out with this one I would be extremely grateful! I think you give the best advice and love your readers comments as well. I promise to send the most adorable pictures of her with her older brothers (who are only 5, 3, and 1…. We are crazy!)

Thank you!

I really like the name you came up with. I feel reluctant to scrap it, even though I know the name Nora is rising in popularity. My first thought is to find a less-common long form of the name Nora, to give you/her options: you could still plan to call her Nora, but could change that plan if the name Nora was suddenly everywhere around you.

Eleanora Summer Iverson (my favorite, but repeats an initial)
Honora Summer Iverson
Lenora Summer Iverson

One downside of the name Nora (and longer versions) is the similarity in sound to the name Morgan. Morgan and Nora.

My eye was also caught by your grandmother’s fabulous name. Agnes Anastasia, oh my goodness. You wouldn’t want to use that as-is, would you? Agnes Anastasia Iverson. Well, I suppose Agnes Iverson could be a little difficult to say. What about Anastasia Summer Iverson? On the slim chance that she wants to marry someone whose surname starts with S, there are options that don’t involve a rude monogram.

I also like Althea and Ramona. Althea doesn’t seem too unusual to me: that is, I know it IS unusual, but when I see the name I know how to say it, and it doesn’t seem weird or trying-too-hard. The name Ramona makes me think of the Beverly Cleary books (positive association) and of the actress Maggie Gyllenhaal (positive association). Maggie Gyllenhaal’s other daughter is named Gloria, if that name has similar appeal. Gloria Summer sounds like glorious summer: this could be a plus or a minus.

Oh! What do you think of Aurora? Starts with A, to honor your grandmother. Sounds similar to Nora but is less common. One downside is that I find Aurora Iverson a bit of a challenge to say.

There’s also Anora/Annora.

Daria might work (though it repeats an initial). Daria Iverson, Daria Summer.

Or Matilda (again, repeats an initial). Matilda Iverson, Matilda Summer.

Is Cora too common? Cora Iverson, Cora Summer.

Or Isadora. Isadora Iverson, Isadora Summer.

Winifred. Winifred Iverson, Winifred Summer.

Henrietta. Henrietta Iverson, Henrietta Summer.

Harriet. Harriet Iverson. Harriet Summer.

Bianca. Bianca Iverson, Bianca Summer.

Or depending on how you feel about repeated sounds (and how strong the repeated-initial preference is), could I interest you in one of my own wish-I-could-use-it names? Minerva Iverson, Minerva Summer. I just love it, and I find the repeated sounds pleasing to say. I’ve been sitting her saying “Minerva Iverson” for a full minute, just for the joy of it.

Or Marilla. Marilla Iverson. Marilla Summer.

Geneva. Geneva Iverson. Geneva Summer.

Name update:

Thank you for the name advice.  We decided to stick with our old favorite.  Nora Sumer (spelled how my sister’s name was spelled, still pronounced like the season) was born October 11, 2016.  Sorry so long on the update.  Things are kind of crazy with 4 kids!   Her 3 big brothers are obsessed!

Hi Swistle!

Just stumbled upon your website and I love it! I am hoping you can help us! My husband and I are expecting our second baby girl in August. Our first baby girl, who will be 2 years old (also in August), is named Audrey June after both of our grandmothers. Our last name is DeJean (the “de” part is pronounced like day and the “jean” part is pronounced like Jeanne – kind of rhymes with pawn). We really like traditional names. We are not into super modern names or alternative spellings. Our list of names we both like is as follows-

Everett (nickname of Evie) Louise as a middle name
Olive
Amelia
Elouise
Beatrice
Colette
Frankie (after my dad who is Frank and would have named a son Frank if he hadn’t had all girls!)

We have had some very strong reactions to the name Everett for a girl- some people love it and others despise it passionately! It was/is our front runner but I am having second thoughts after learning of this! I love Everett for a girl. Something about the -ett ending makes it feminine sounding to me. Its traditional and old fashioned but using it for a girl rather than a boy gives it uniqueness. My husband loves the nickname Evie, although we have noticed how popular it is recently.

I have always loved Olive but am not sure if it’s too “out there.”

My husband is hesitant about Frankie. He thinks it might not be easy for every personality type to pull off.

I’m almost to the point of scratching Amelia off the list because of its popularity and the two A names.

If I could have seen into the future and knew we would be having another girl, I may have saved the name June to use as this baby’s first name. But it’s already been used as Audrey’s middle name so that’s that!

My husband has an interesting family name and if we ever have a boy he will pass that name on. He goes by his middle name- Darr. If we have a boy in the future, he would go by Darr as well. We are planning on having 3 children in total but we will see how number 2 goes first!

Hoping you can help! Let me know if you need any more information! Thank you :)

If this were your first girl and most of the names on your list were names traditionally used for boys, I would say Everett was a great option: the feminine nickname Evie makes it flexible, and the -et ending is familiar in names currently used for girls (Charlotte, Scarlet, Violet). Because this is your second girl, and because your first girl has a traditional girls-only name, and because almost every other girl name on your list is a girls-only name, I’d say Everett is an outlier for your style: you both like it, but it doesn’t fit with everything else you like.

In cases where parents have an outlier name they’d like to use, I generally suggest using it as a middle name, or finding a name that is similar to the outlier name but falls within the parents’ usual style. For the name Everett, this would mean names such as Harriet, Margaret, Evelyn, Scarlett, Violet, Charlotte, Vera, Everly, Vivian, Genevieve, Greta, Ivy, Veronica, etc.

From your list, Eloise (spelled the usual way, even if you are honoring a Louise) is my favorite option, with Beatrice and Colette tied for a very close second.

Because you would like to use the name June, I might look for names that seemed similar to it. “Similar” is very subjective, but to me that means names such as May, Ruth, Lucy, Juliet, Julia, Ruby, Rose. (Normally I would also say Jane and Jean and Joan, but those don’t seem ideal with the surname.)

I share your husband’s hesitations about the name Frankie. I would use Francesca with the nickname Frankie; this gives her options is she turns out not to be the Frankie type. [Ooo, commenter Liz mentioned Frances, and I like that even better.]

Name update:

Thank you all for your thoughtful input! Colette Louise made her debut a few weeks ago and we couldn’t be more in love with both her and her name. Thank you, again!

Hi Swistle,

I’m due with a boy in July. We have a name ready for him already, but I’ve recently realized a potential problem and I was wondering, now that they’re working again, if it might be possible to use your trusty polling to help figure out if this potential problem is something I should worry about or not.

I’m actually surprised I hadn’t needed to write to you sooner because my husband and I were pretty far apart when it came to naming styles. Like many husbands, mine was partial to the names he grew up with in the 1970s and 1980s (particularly the girls he had crushes on – what is up with that?!). For a girl, he would be very happy to use the name Jennifer. (Me? Not so much.) We were able to find a name for this child in the end but literally only one. (This is not a “take options to the hospital” situation.) The only name we’ve agreed on is Maxwell (nn Max). I think it’s great. My husband thinks it’s great. We’re both happy. So what’s the problem?

I know Max is on the more popular side these days, though I’m not aware of any in my group of friends with kids. Still, I know there is a potential for him to not be the only Max in class. And our last name begins with C. So he may be Max C. I was in the shower the other day when I suddenly realized that Max C sounds like “maxi”. So now I’m concerned about “maxi pad” teasing. So my question is this: Does the potential for “maxi pad” teasing make the name unusable? Or, rather, would it stop you or your readers from using the name? I don’t want to saddle my child with something he’ll hate. Of course, being pregnant and hormonal means I could be blowing this out of proportion, so I’d love the feedback. If we need to go back to the drawing board, we need all the time we can get!

Thanks!
Hettie

If there is literally only one name you and your husband can agree on, then our task is to see if we can eliminate/avoid any problems with it, not to rule it out for something that may or may not be a problem.

For it to be a problem, ALL of these things would have to happen:

1. He would have to be in a classroom with more than one Max.
2. There would have to be only one possible solution: to call him Max C.
3. “Max C.” would have to sound like “maxi” to other people.
4. “Maxi” would have to make those people think of “maxi pad.”
5. Those people would have to choose to use that as a taunting nickname.

ALL OF THOSE THINGS would have to happen together. When even the first thing on the list is something that may never happen—and if it did, the second thing on the list is not true.

My kids have periodically been in classrooms where more than one kid has the same name. There have been VARIOUS solutions to this, and I believe it is always determined via discussion. That is, so far I don’t believe any of the teachers have said, “Right. So I will call YOU this, and YOU that.” Instead it is “How shall we handle this?” Sometimes the solution is Madison L. and Madison H. Sometimes the solution is Madison and Maddy. Sometimes the solution is Maddy Jane and Maddy Rose. Sometimes the solution is Madison Elridge and Madison Arthur. Sometimes the solution is Maddy and MJ.

Even if your Max is in a classroom with another Max, AND even if Max C. would lead everyone immediately to call him Maxi Pad, ruining his childhood—EVEN SO, there are so many options that avoid this path. He could go by Maxwell while the other Max goes by Max, or he could go by Maxwell C., or by M.C., or by Wells, or by his first and middle names, or by his first and middle initials, or by his first name and middle initial.

I will put up a poll. I am concerned, however, that this will bring us to the phenomenon where a hundred people can say a name is great, but it’s hard to ignore the one person who says “Bleah.” Or where an author/actor/screenwriter can get a hundred glowing reviews, but it’s the one negative one that sticks with them. I could put up a poll for ANY ISSUE IN THE WORLD, even an issue where you would think NO ONE would vote that it was a problem (“Does the name Emily make you think of strippers?”) and SOMEONE would vote that it was a problem. Still, if a poll would help, I will put up a poll:

[yop_poll id=”67″]

Name update:

Hi Swistle! You posted my question back in May. I’d held off sending an update because I felt as though “and we named him Max” would be the most boring update ever. I wondered if I should wait until he’d been through elementary school and let you know if he ever had to be referred to as Max C and the implications of that. But that seemed a little extreme. So instead I will tell you that we did name him Maxwell (nn Max) (probably not a surprise) and that your comments and those of your readers helped me feel MUCH better about choosing it. But I also have to tell you that I hadn’t been as excited about the name as I’d hoped I’d be (maybe because we came to it so early and had no other real contenders; I’m not sure), which was compounded by the fact that we were hearing the name Max a bunch after he was born (around in public places but also by a friend who had her baby a month later and also used Maxwell). But I was rocking him in the middle of the night the other night and the words “baby Max” went through my head. At that moment, a warm feeling came over me and I realized it was about the name. It took a while, but now I totally love it. (I still prefer that people not call him Maxi though. Ha!) Thanks again, Hettie

Hello! I know you are probably inundated with requests, but… I have been twirling this issue around in my own mind until I’m about going crazy, and I wondered if a another perspective or two would be helpful. Your recent post about how to honor an Adolf and what naming practices are actually honorific made me think of writing to you.

I’m due with a baby girl in July. I have always liked the name Charlotte, but when it zoomed up the charts I totally crossed it off my personal list. Logically I know that popularity isn’t what it used to be, and that no name (even the #1 name) is going to be like Jennifer in its heyday. But still, I admit to feeling a bit superior to people who use names in the top ten, as though they were lacking in imagination or something.

Until. I was talking to my grandmother the other day about names and casually mentioned Charlotte (actually more as a red herring than anything, since I didn’t feel like sharing names I was seriously considering). She responded that it had been the favorite name of my great-grandfather as it had been his own mother’s name. I guess he loved it enough that he even used to offer each of his children/grandchildren $50 to name their daughters Charlotte! (There were no takers; there are no Charlottes even in my very large extended family.) Now, this great-grandpa was very important to me and lived with our family from when I was 14 until 17. I loved him dearly and have wanted to honor him in my one of my children’s name in some way (although his name of Loy Frank left me puzzled of the best way to do that, since “Loy” and “Frank” were not my favorite options).

So, now I’m feeling much more torn. I feel like giving my baby the name Charlotte might honor a man whom I loved very much by giving her his favorite name, plus it’s a family name since it belonged to his mother. It’s a name I like anyway (probably because it’s the great-great-grandmother’s name, rather than anything less distant!). And I kind of love the story that he offered to give his posterity $50 to use it. However, I’m not sure how much of an honor name that it would actually be – it’s his favorite name, not his own name after all.

So I suppose my question is this – do you feel like using a favorite name is enough of an honor that it would override popularity concerns? Does the fact that he essentially campaigned for the name to be used by his posterity make it more honorific? I feel like if the situation had been that it was my beloved great-grandmother named Charlotte herself, rather than my beloved great-grandfather whose favorite name was Charlotte, there would be no question that popularity would be over-riden. However, is the “honor” of a favorite name great enough to override the consideration of popularity? I am especially curious since Charlotte, while a classic, has certainly been “spikey” (for lack of a better term) recently and could easily head to #1. I am unsure if that name will tie her to a time period in a way that another classic, but less “spikey,” name would do. I know I could move it to the middle spot and that would solve the popularity problem, but that feels to me like it removes the honor in this situation since his wish was clearly to have one of his own posterity use that name as the first name, not the middle.

I would love to hear any ideas you may have. My husband doesn’t get interested in thinking about names until a few weeks before birth, so he’s not really any help and I’m kind of going crazy trying to consider it all on my own. For what it’s worth, her older brothers are Colton David and Graham Jacob; their firsts are names we loved, their middles are after my husband Dave and my maiden name of Jacobs (I ditched the “s” to avoid having him sound like a law firm with three surname-names). I’d love any thoughts you have! Thanks!

My usual test is to ask “Does this name make you think of the honoree?” My guess, just reading your letter, is that from now on, every time you hear the name Charlotte, you are going to think of that story about your great-grandfather, whether or not you use the name yourself. So my short answer is yes, in this case I think it works as an honor name, and since you liked it ANYWAY, I think this could give you that last little shove.

I think the story of your great-grandfather offering money to his descendants makes a great naming story. Many of us are not close to our great-grandparents, but you were, and this seems like a fun way to remember him, especially since you are not keen on his actual names. Plus, it was his mother’s name. I think I would tell the story roughly as it happened: “We loved the name Charlotte but felt it might be too popular to use. Then I found out this family story, and that was enough to push us into using it.”

But you may find as you think about it over the next few months that it’s NOT enough to give you that last little shove. You’re right about the name’s recent popularity (it was #10 in 2014; within the next few days we should be finding out from the Social Security Administration how the name was ranked in 2015) [follow-up: #9 in 2015], and that may continue to bother you even with this added reason to overlook it. Or you may find you like the other names on your list more, and that they meet more of your preferences.

As you know, I am not especially keen on messing too much with honor names for my own use. But I don’t mind playing around a bit with other people’s options. For example, Francesca Loy would be a pretty cute name: uncommon, great nicknames including Frank and Frankie. Colton, Graham, and Francesca.

I think Loy in general makes a workable middle name. Possibly not one we might choose out of a baby name book on its own merits, but a definite honor name, and one that appeals to me as a middle name with many girl names. Margaret Loy. Carrigan Loy. Fiona Loy. Audra Loy. Piper Loy. Delaney Loy. Ruby Loy. Miranda Loy. Harriet Loy. Eleanor Loy.

Name update:

Hello! I emailed you a few months ago about whether using someone’s favorite name would be considered an honor name. Our baby girl was born a few days ago and a day after she was born we finally settled on her name. After all that time I spent worried about picking a name that was too popular, it’s kind of funny to me that both the names we gave her are in the top 50: Charlotte Ella. I loved Charlotte and it is meaningful enough to me that I wanted to give her that name despite its popularity, and Ella is her daddy’s favorite name that he really wanted to use. Thank you to you and your readers for reassuring me that hopefully she will find her name meaningful, as I do, rather than trendy. In the end, we both got to use our favorites and we love her name. We plan on calling her Charlotte sometimes and Lottie sometimes, and we feel it suits her perfectly. Thanks again!

Dear Swistle,

We are expecting our third (and last) child, a girl, in early July. We have two other girls who are older (there will be a 4 and 5 year gap) and about a year apart. They are Annabel Quinn and Lucy Colleen. Last name is Stuart spelled the other way.

With our first we quickly agreed on Annabel during pregnancy, and with #2 I was so sure that we were having a boy that I didn’t worry about girl names (baby boy would have been Asher, my husband’s pick, all three times). When #2 came I didn’t have time to stress and obsess over a name but I remember looking at her and being so certain that she was not a “Lila” (our top girl pick) but 100% a Lucy. The name suits her so perfectly it feels like a miracle that I was able to pick it out just minutes after giving birth. No name on our list feels like “the one” and I’m afraid #3 and whatever miracle happened with Lucy will not happen and I won’t know what her name should be.

This pregnancy also represents the first time we’ve found out the sex ahead of time. With this being our last baby I only wanted to imagine what he or she was and not imagine both possibilities for 9 months. However, coming up with another girl name has been a lot harder than I thought it would be. I also think my anxiety about the natural imbalance of having three children is coming out in our naming process. I don’t want 2 names to have one trait that the other doesn’t have and thus someone is “left out”. (As if I can fix all future sibling problems by just picking the right name.) While I understand this is (a bit) irrational I’m afraid my crazy pregnant brain is making this choice carry way more weight than it should but I can’t seem to make myself stop overanalyzing. (Note, my husband has zero of these concerns and is mostly saying yes or no to my name ideas while letting me spin my wheels on all the implications of each name).

With all of that said, I am trying not to have too many “rules” about this name. The two most important are:

1) Can’t end with “s” sound because the sound gets lost with our last name.

2) Must be a new initial. No “A” or “L” names.

This is not a rule but I would prefer that the name also have a distinct sound from the two we’ve already named (especially the ending). This is hardest with Lucy as a lot of names I like end in Y.

To make things even more difficult we want the middle name to be Emily or Lee (All the middles are honor names and while I prefer Emily because that was her name, she was called Lee by everyone and my husband doesn’t care between the two). This middle has been somewhat difficult to work with. One name I love, Ivy, sounds awkward with Emily and Lee (Ivy Lee makes me think of Ivy League).

 

Names I love that husband has vetoed:

Violet – My favorite. This would be THE name but my husband hates it.
Tessa
Isla
Cora (Nora is also off the table as it is the name of a close cousin of the girls)
Mila
Matilda
Celia

 

Names my husband loves that I have vetoed:

Felicity

 

Names on our list:

Rosemary (Lee) – I worry that this is too old or too much of a name. (And Lucy’s name would seem so short in comparison to the other two names). We would use Rose but it sounds like Ro Stuart. This name is my husband’s favorite. She would probably be called Rosie.

Eliza (Emily/Lee) – Sometimes I love this name and sometimes I’m not sure because with the long E it feels a little hard to say. I love the spunkyness and the character history (Eliza Bennett, Eliza Doolittle).

Hazel (Emily) – I love the sound and that it goes well with Emily. I am not afraid of popularity but I don’t want something trendy and I think that comes with quick rises and falls of names. I am afraid this name is rising too fast (apparently due to a popular book).

Poppy – not sure if this works with Emily or Lee. Don’t love that it ends in Y like Lucy. Love that it reminds me of my home state of California. It’s very rare in the US and that worries me a little. Although my husband likes the name a lot he jokes that it sounds like “Papi”.

Emily as a first name – Again, I am not afraid of popularity but it seems like if there was going to be something close to a “Jennifer” of the last few decades this would be it. I am not sure if that would drive me (or this child) crazy. We know a lot of Emily’s.

Names ending in “A” seem to work best and it seems like there should be a lot of them and yet I swear I have looked at them all and nothing stands out. Perhaps I need to be pointed in the direction of names I’ve already seen but have overlooked or perhaps I just need reassurance that the list we already have is full of great names and my concerns are silly. This process is making me neurotic and I really want an objective third party opinion. Please help a crazy pregnant lady out.

—

Rebecca

I know just what you mean about pregnancy-based over-analyzing, as I am/was a similar type. And so I don’t expect my words to carry much weight here, because I remember how words such as these bounced off of me when I was in your shoes. But I will say them anyway: most of the “two names share a trait, so the third name would be left out” concerns just VANISH after the baby is named. For example, three of my boys have the same number of syllables in their names; the fourth has a different number of syllables. This made me feel batty during pregnancy, but thinking about it at this point I had to think carefully about which name it was that was different, and why was it different: it hasn’t crossed my mind since, except as an example of how things that matter very much during the naming process can turn out to matter very little later on. Nor has this child come to me and said, “Mother, the number of syllables in my name makes me feel different from my brothers. Did you…love me less?”

I do think it’s nice, when possible, to avoid STARTLING differences. For example, if you went for Annabel and Lucy for your first two daughters and then wanted to name your third daughter Christopher, I would caution you to take sibling-name coordination into consideration for the sake of everyone involved. But if we are talking about two names ending in the same letter or starting with the same letter or having the same number of syllables, my experience (and current lack of pregnancy) has left me mercifully relaxed.

One exercise I’ve found useful is to think about other sibling groups I know, and consider whether I’ve ever noticed similar issues. For example, let’s say a friend of yours has kids named Aidan, Emerson, and Alex, and you’ve never noticed until now that two are A names and one is not, or that two are -n names and one is not, or that two are 2-syllable names and one is not. If you HAVE noticed, and always DO notice, then I take back what I said about pregnancy hormones and I think we should really work hard to find a name that is equally different from the other two.

Well. In any case, you will find me more than willing to play name-puzzle games: I may be in favor of letting such things go, but they’re still FUN. That is, as long as they ARE still fun: when they start getting stressful, let’s stop. For now, we are looking for a name that does not start with A or L, does not end in -s or -l or -y, does not seem a lot longer or shorter than Annabel or Lucy, does not share dominant sounds with Annabel or Lucy, and goes well with the middle name Emily or Lee. First let’s consider the names on your list.

1. Rosemary. Annabel, Lucy, and Rosemary. I think these go together just fine, and that the name Rosemary is neither too old nor too much. I am not worried about Lucy having a shorter name, particularly if Rosemary will go by Rosie. One thing you could say is that Annabel and Rosemary are both longer names, and Lucy and Rosemary both end in -y. Play UP the similarities, instead of playing them down.

2. Eliza. Annabel, Lucy, and Eliza. One of my own top favorite names, so I am rooting for this one. I love it with the sister names; I love it with your surname. It meets every single preference. If you said, “Swistle, please choose the name for the baby,” this is the name I would choose.

3. Hazel. Annabel, Lucy, and Hazel. I think this another good grouping, but I am still dazzled by Eliza. Also, this would give you two -el names (I don’t think this matters, but it does if we are solving this like a puzzle).

4. Poppy. Annabel, Lucy, and Poppy.  Poppy feels lightweight to me. I wish it were the nickname for something weightier. Maybe Philippa?

5. Emily. Annabel, Lucy, and Emily. I love the name Emily, but/and I see the issue you mention of it being quite popular for quite a long time. It doesn’t feel dated to me, but it does feel like it has lost some freshness.

6. Ivy. Annabel, Lucy, and Ivy. It’s not officially on the list, but I’m putting it there in case it belongs there. I think Ivy Emily is pretty fun to say. I agree it wouldn’t be my first pick on sound/rhythm alone, but considering how important it is to use Emily/Lee, I think it works perfectly well enough to use, and not in a displeasing way at all. And I love Ivy with Annabel and Lucy.

Now let’s add to the list.

1. Eloise. I think of this name when I see the name Eliza, because the sounds are so similar. Eloise Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Eloise.

2. Daisy. This came to mind after seeing Rosemary, Hazel, Eliza, Violet, and Poppy: the Z sound of the first three, the nature sound of all but Eliza. It does end in -Y, but I don’t think of that as a problem except for the purposes of playing this like a game. Daisy Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Daisy.

3. Flora. Another nature-theme possibility, similar to Cora. Flora Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Flora.

4. Clara. I just love it with the surname and the sibling names, and it meets all the preferences. Clara Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Clara.

5. Fiona. Another I love with the surname and sibling names, and it meets all the preferences. Fiona Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Fiona.

6. Pearl. Pearl Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Pearl. Ends in -l, but the -rl blend makes it seem quite different than Annabel’s -el. I like the descending number of syllables: 3, 2, 1.

7. Georgia. Georgia Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Georgia. I heard this name on a little girl at the mall and was practically knocked over by how adorable it was.

8. Simone. Simone Stuart; Annabel, Lucy, and Simone. I don’t know why; I just thought of it and liked it.

Name update:

Hi Swistle!

After reading your response and the many comments we pretty much went into labor with Rose (yes just Rose) and Eliza as the solid frontrunners!  I liked the simplicity of Rose vs. Rosemary and the comments overwhelming said they thought it would be fine with our last name.  When we met her she was such a peanut (smaller than our other two), and the name Rose just seemed to suit her best.  So Rose Emily, called Rosie it is.

The feedback provided was so valuable in clearing my head.  Eliza was and still is my favorite name but just didn’t seem like the right name for her.  Rose was my husbands clear favorite and I don’t mind at all that we ended with his favorite over mine.  Thank you again!

~Rebecca, Aaron, Annabel, Lucy & Rose