Alice writes:

we need help! obviously. I’m going to give birth NEXT WEEK to our 5th child. It’s a boy. we don’t have a name.
our other kids–oh wait. our names are Alice and Ethan Bond. Bond is a surname we just adopted because we are both estranged from our families. i don’t exactly suggest being estranged from your family but after seeing what some friends went thru to honor every single person on their family tree, well..
anyway.
When I was preg with our first child we had NO idea what to name her. Then one day we came across the old folk song little Liza Jane” and in one of those awesome moments we just glanced at each other and grinned really widely. So our first daughter is
Liza Jane Bond
(in retrospect i might’ve picked a different middle, not in love with the 1-1-1 flow of her name)
When i was preg the 2nd time we LOVED having a special song for our girl. Liza asked for the song ALL the time–at 8 she still does–and her room was/is decorated with a super artistic print of the lyrics, and we just loved it. we wanted the same thing for our 2nd child. we knew it was a girl, we thought about carefully and we came up with
Matilda Clare Bond
Waltzing Matilda, obviously. Clare is just a name we like.
in between M and her sister we lost a baby in the womb. Before we knew she was dead we’d named her Susannah Rose. we consider Susannah our daughter even tho we never really met her which is why i say we’re on our 5th kid–kind of our 5th, kind of our 4th!
Our youngest is–and this took a LOT of thought but obviously we’d decided to continue the pattern–
Clementine Louise Bond
so the problem is this: we LOVE having daughters named after folks songs. and we love that they have very traditional mns just in case they need them-Jane, Clare, Louise. all 3 girls LOVE having their “own” song, and love singing them, and its just a great system.
this will be our last child. and its a BOY. and we are stuck! for middle names we like:
Alexander
Elliot
Graham
Miles (our favorite, will use if it works with the first name)
But we cannot come up with a first name! we feel like if it was a girl we’d have an easier time and also HAVE to stick with our pattern but with a boy maybe he could have something else special about his name? the thing is our girls LOVE their names and the whole song tie in. the other day we were talking about it and Matilda (our classic middle child, so sensitive) got really upset at the idea that the baby might not have a song name.
but we can’t think of ANY folks songs, aside from John Henry which is we don’t really like, that have boys names. there are some more obscure songs, but they are REALLY obscure…and we just can’t find anything that carries on the tradition from our girls in the way we want. so, um, HELP????

I suggest Daniel/Danny or Jude or John(ny).

Danny is from Danny Boy, and it’s a little morbid, but so are Waltzing Matilda and Oh My Darling, Clementine.

Jude is from Hey, Jude, a slightly cheerier choice in that it deals with divorce rather than death.

John(ny) is in many, many songs, but the ones that come to my mind are Who’s Johnny?, Johnny B. Goode, and Johnny Angel. I’m not sure John Bond works, though.

I’m not familiar with many folk songs, but you could also see if there’s anything here: Songs with Boys’ Names in the Title or Baby Names Inspired by Popular Songs, or Names in Song Titles, or Boys Names From Songs, or Boy Names From Song, or Traditional and Folk Song Titles, or Song Names.

Name update! Alice writes:

thank you SO MUCH for all the help and thanks also so much to all of your commenters! that was SO helpful and actually i was reading them all while i was in labor! well, ethan was reading them to me.
anyway, they were great, thank you! we did like the james idea but naming the poor kid james bond seemed a little unfair. but we loved so many of the suggestions. other faves were Louis, Jude, Jeremiah, Henry…we liked a lot of them.
But in the end, we went with:
Daniel Tucker Bond
And we sing Old dan Tucker ALL THE TIME. the girls love, love love having a baby brother and we adore him, and his song has become a regular part of our day. only downside is the girls want to wash his hair in a frying pan…
thanks again for all the help!

Wendy writes:

My husband and I are expecting our first child, a girl, in early November. To start out, our Norwegian last name is pronounced ronHAHVdee.

We pretty much had a boy’s name picked out, but I had a long list of girls’ names, some of which my husband vetoed almost immediately (Shea, Eden, Peyton, Leighton). When we started the process, my husband said that I could make the list, and he would pick from it (hence the elimination so quickly). Here is our dilemma…we think we have settled on Camryn (pronounced like Cameron) although I haven’t fully ruled out McKenna. I thought I could sneak in one of my eliminated names for the middle name (Camryn Shea), but no such luck.

My middle name is Lynn and my mother-in-law’s name is Lynne. And every name my mom has suggested has had the middle name Lynn because she likes it so much. So in a way, we’d be honoring me, my mom and mother-in-law with Camryn Lynn, but I never really liked my middle name. I would have much rather had Leigh. So now I’m considering Camryn Leigh, which my husband is fine with (but he also likes Camryn Lynn).

A side note: the one thing about going with Camryn is the thought that I am setting my daughter up for a lifetime of spelling and pronouncing both her first AND last name. Additionally, she will probably never find her name on one of those custom bicycle license plates or cool name pencil for school in a gift shop.

With Camryn Leigh, we aren’t honoring anyone, and we don’t care for any other female family names either. So, back to the grandmothers, my mom is Sally (nickname for Sarah which is a family name) so we could do Sarah Lynn or Sarah Lynne to honor both mothers. I do love the name Sarah, and it is a classic name, but I know so many Sarah’s, and I’m afraid it might sound a little old fashioned as my daughter grows older.

So I’m really torn about using a family name which I don’t care for, so we can honor the grandmothers (and by the way, we know that this is probably going to be our only child). Or honor neither and go with a name we choose because we like it.

Help! And thank you in advance for your consideration!

 
Two previous posts that might be of use here: Name Advice for First-Time Parents and Choosing Between Two Finalists.

Now I’ll turn to your other concerns, and I hope knock them down like little bowling pins, clonk clonk.

Concern #1: A Camryn won’t be able to find personalized pencils and license plates. For the number of times I’ve heard personalized license plates mentioned, I’d expect to see them on almost every bike in town, with the poor uncommon-named children sitting despondent on the sidewalk, too sad to even ride their plateless bikes—and yet I don’t know the last time I’ve seen a name plate on a bike or even seen them in a store. The store where I last saw a small selection of them was mostly stocked not with actual plates but with order forms. Pencils are the same: there is indeed a small selection of names available in some stores, but it’s easy and cheap to order a set online. The internet may be a mixed bag of pros and cons, but I’d say it’s eliminated the problem of not being able to find personalized products.

Concern #2: A Camryn will have to constantly spell her first and last name. It’s true, she will, but so does everyone else. A favorite anecdote in our family is when a family friend with a very difficult surname was ordering a pizza to pick up on her way home, and she said as she was dialing that she always uses “Smith” because she gets so sick of having to spell her surname. Then we heard her place her order, and then she said “Smith,” and then there was a pause and she said “S…m…i…t…h.” If you choose Sarah, she’ll constantly have to tell people whether it’s Sarah or Sara (or even Sera, Sierra, Cera, etc.). It’s so common now to change spellings, even a Jane Smith has to spell her name. This isn’t to say it’s not a good thing to keep in mind (there’s a huge difference between having to spell Sarah Smith and having to spell Mykinzeigh VonJacht), but Camryn is a widely-accepted spelling.

BUT: Since you love both Camryn and Sarah, I’d cast my vote with Sarah. A modern name could sound time-stamped in another decade, but a name that’s been popular for centuries is unlikely to result in anyone saying anything along the lines of “I have such a SEVENTIES name.” And I love that the name Sarah Lynne would honor both grandmothers, particularly if this will be your only child. And I suspect that Sally is going to become one of the next hip throwback nicknames. And you’d definitely be able to find the pencils and license plates and Christmas ornaments.

But this is strongly influenced by my own preference for the style of Sarah, and also I have a dear friend named Sara, and also I love family names. I can equally well argue against my own points in the previous paragraph (as I already have on the subject of personalized products) by adding that I don’t think time-stamping is something important (or even always possible, or preferable) to avoid. I’m a 1970s Kristen, but I kind of like it that people don’t have to meet me to know basically how old I am: there aren’t many elderly women or small children named Kristen, so I feel like my name makes sense for me—just as a name that currently feels modern will make sense for people born now. (I still vote for Sarah, though.)

About the middle name. If you choose your mother’s name Sarah as the first name, I’d recommend using the Lynne (mother-in-law) spelling for the middle name. If you spell it Lynn, it does increase the fun of matching mother/daughter middle names—but then the name is clearly after you, and only coincidentally happens to be your mother-in-law’s name. If you use Camryn as the first name, I think it’s the same deal (Lynne honors your mother-in-law; Lynn is after you and what a happy coincidence it’s the mother-in-law’s name too), but it’s less politically important which you choose since no one else is being honored.

If your dislike of the name Lynn/Lynne causes you to not want to use it, I wonder if you’d like something in the Lynneleigh/Lynnley/Linley area. It diminishes the honor (especially the further the spelling gets from Lynne), but perhaps at a worth-it cost. Or perhaps at that point it would be better to go with Leigh. Or Camryn Sarahlynne.

Let’s have a poll over to the right for Camryn and Sarah, and I’ll put McKenna in there too since it sounds like it’s still on the finalist list. [Poll closed; see results below.]

Name update! Wendy writes:

Hi Swistle! First, I just want to thank you and all your readers for your help and suggestions on our name dilemma. I loved reading each post and checking in on the voting poll.

I am happy to announce that we welcomed our beautiful baby daughter, Camryn Lynn, on November 16th. It was a tough decision right up until the end, but I have to say that I have received so many compliments on the name, and we were able to honor both grandmothers with the middle name Lynn.

After much discussion after your post, my husband and I eliminated Sarah (too common) and McKenna from the running. However, we did add Riley as a late entry to the list of consideration. I was so torn between the two names right up until one week before she arrived. One day I favored Riley, and the next I favored Camryn and I was driving myself (not to mention my husband) crazy. We were going to go to the hospital with both names and wait to see which name she looked like, but I was afraid to make such a spontaneous decision. So finally, on my actual due date (11/9), I just made an executive decision to go with Camryn Lynn.

So, I feel a little bit guilty that our daughter is going to have to spell her first and last name her entire life (but as you said in your post, who doesn’t?). But I have to say, I do not regret the decision at all. Thank you again for your input and thank you to everyone who weighed in!

Maddie writes:

HELLO!

I’m 32 weeks pregnant with twin girls! Wow I’m huge.

Anyway, my husband and I have the standard opposite taste issue, wherein his ideal name is something like Natalie, and mine is something like Ione, Idris, or Cadia – by which I mean he likes things that sound conventional and feminine and I like things that sound…I dunno. Unique and more gender-neutral, I guess. But this puts our compromise zone somewhere in the realm of many of your readers and writers – we’re looking for a name that’s not too common but still pronounceable, traditional but unusual, and basically the same thing everyone else is looking for. Another compromise possibility is the nature name, Willow, Rose, etc, but our last name is Forrester. So that’s a toughie. We want the two names to coordinate but not be matchy-matchy.

Middle names are set (almost), as our family tends to use last names as middle names. One middle name will be my maiden name, Stone, and the other will either be one of his family names, Lawton, or possibly (especially if we pick a gender neutral name), another family name: Louise. They’ll have an older brother named Sam (Samuel). (Don’t even get me STARTED on that naming process, WOW was it tough, though in the end we went for a name we decided we’d name our theoretical son during a romantic moment in 2002. He’s kinda named after Yosemite Sam. Yeah, I know. Moving on!)

So, as this is my way, I created a spreadsheet with LOTS of names, and we each rated each name 1-10, and then we added the scores, and now we have a “short list,” to which we are not committed at all. None of my weird name preferences made the cut, as they were all torpedoed and given a 1 by him; none of his cheerleader names made it, either, as I gave them 2’s. Though I have to say, looking at this mathematically, that I generally liked way more names than he did. My average score across the names was around a 7, his was closer to a 3.

Here’s the list (and the rankings):

First place (18.5 points):

* Edie (which would be short for either Eden or Edith. Edith has family significance, but it really hard to match. I love Eden, but we’re not a religious family. Is it too religious?)

Second place (18 points):

* Linden
* Phoebe

Third Place (17 points):

* Lillian

Fourth Place (16 points):

* Annabelle
* Eliza
* Lyra
* Calla

Fifth Place (15 points):

* Jill
* Juliet
* Molly
* Sadia

Honorable Mentions (14 points, but with 7-7 splits, meaning we kinda agree on them, I didn’t include the 14-ers that were 10-4)

* Clara
* Eleanor
* Jillian
* Penelope

The one fairly unusual name we both like but feel like we really can’t slap a kid with is Persephone, or Percy for short. SO CUTE. But so many syllables! And I’m not sure it passes the resume test, even though stylistically it’s actually quite similar to Stephanie, right? Also, how the heck do you match Persephone? We do also like Willa and Isadora (the second of which means “gift of fertility,” which seems oh so appropriate for one of these very surprising twins.) We’d probably go for Izzy as a nickname, but Sadie is also an option. Our closest winning combo as of yesterday is Eden Stone and Linden Louise. Edie and Lindy. Lindy Lou. Linden, however, is a tree. Could we use it with Forrester? Anyway, we change our minds all the time!

The meanings themselves are not our primary concern, but we don’t want to inadvertently categorize or label the girls. For example, we were thinking of Edith Stone and Calla Lawton for a while, but Edith means “powerful in battle,” and Calla means “pretty,” so……..no-go. As a note! I was completely willing to go for Louise, or maybe Louisa, as a first name if I’d be allowed to use the nickname Lua, which I think is beautiful. This idea did not catch on.

Anyway – what do you think? Will we ever find two names that make us both happy? Could you put Persephone on a resume? Should we just each name one and have a completely mismatched Natalie and Idris? Help?

 
I love the spreadsheet. I love it.

Though Eden is a place name from the Bible, I think of it as a non-religious name that a religious person could use with another layer of meaning—similar to the name Noah, which is fully mainstreamed yet to a religious person would have the added benefit of the biblical association.

I wonder if you’d like a name I’ve encountered the last few years (that is, I’ve encountered a single person WITH this name periodically over the last few years, and each time I hear her name I have a positive reaction to it): Eidelyn. It’s pronounced like the word eye, then a dah/deh sound and then a lyn—with the emphasis on the eye syllable. The nickname is Eidey, which rhymes with Heidi and is one vowel-sound off from Edie. One reason I think it might be a good fit for your family is that the name is highly unusual/exotic—and yet I, with my generally mainstream/common tastes, find I like it. So I have hopes it will appeal to both of you.

I’d pair it with Lorelei, another unusual/exotic name that appeals to my conventional tastes. Eidelyn and Lorelei. I like how they sound quite different but also have the “eye” sound in common (and the same number of syllables), and I like the visual compatibility of them: same number of letters, the repeating E and I and L.

However, this gives us a middle name problem. If you feel the way I do about initials that spell things, Eidelyn can’t be with either Louise or Lawton—but with Stone, maybe it sounds like “idol in stone”? One option is to find another spelling. Idelyn, for example. Idelyn Louise and Lorelei Stone. (I think I’d copy one of my friends here: she had one of her twins be the “older/firstborn” twin and have the less-significant family name, and the other twin had the more significant family name—so they each had something special.) Or maybe Eidelyn Stone is not a big deal, since they’ll hardly ever be said together, and maybe only sound like “idol in stone” to people with a lot of Sunday School in their backgrounds.

Another option would be to abandon the family-name middle names, and do each name like this: your favorites from his list as first names; his favorites from your list as middle names. I love family names, so I’m reluctant to push this—but something like Phoebe Idris and Eliza Ione might work very nicely, or Eliza Penelope and Annabel Persephone.

I want to put a huge positive push for Persephone—but I think what I really want is for it to get more common so we can all use it without worrying about it being too odd. (I think I would spell the nickname “Persey” or “Persie,” to increase the association with the full version.) You’re right: it’s so similar to Stephanie, there’s no reason it shouldn’t be used—and yet it isn’t used. I think I would pair it with Seraphina or Felicity or Philomena or Willemina or Anastasia—another long unusual name. With nicknames Percy and Sera, or Percy and Fliss, or Percy and Phil, or Percy and Willa, or Percy and Annie. There’s also Sophronia, with the adorable nickname Phronsie (I remember this from The Five Little Peppers). Percy and Phronsie. And I think Isadora goes well with it too: Persephone and Isadora, Percy and Izzie.

Or do you like any of those sibling-name-for-Persephone names together, without Persephone? Felicity and Anastasia is my favorite set. Felicity Louise and Anastasia Stone. Or Felicity Lawton and Annabel Stone.

To me, Linden with Forrester is fine. I knew Linden was a tree, so I can’t explain why it doesn’t bother me. It just doesn’t, that’s all. I like Linden and Phoebe together (a phoebe is a bird, which goes nicely with tree) instead of Linden and Eden: the repeating -den endings of Linden and Eden bothers me a little, and also the way one girl gets three letters with her -den and the other gets only one. (I put the tree/-den things in the same paragraph because I think it demonstrates nicely the huge subjectivity of baby-naming. The next person reading this could think “WHAT!! But to me the tree thing is a big problem, and the ‘number of letters’ thing is ridiculous! And I LIKE the twinniness of the matching endings!”)

I think Lyra and Calla are beautiful together. Lyra Stone and Calla Lawton.

Or Iris and Calla. Calla Lawton and Iris Stone.

I also love Penelope and Annabel. Annabel Stone and Penelope Lawton. Annie and Penny.

Isadora (“gift of fertility”) would be nice with Felicity (“lucky, happy”). Izzy and Fliss.

From nowhere: Imogen Stone and Bronwyn Louise. Beatrix Lawton and Genevieve Stone.

I’m getting a little overwhelmed—so many great names, so many interesting combinations! What would the rest of you pair up?

Name updates! Maddie writes:

Hey hey!

Welcome to baby girls Cl@ra R0berts and Ph0ebe St0ne F0rrester!

Based on everyone’s input, I actually pulled hard for Persephone/Persey (and I agreed with you on the spelling), but even though my darling husband actually suggested it, he was not to be persuaded. Which is fine, I love their names. We ended up with what I would describe as classic names that I also love. They go well with my son’s name, and I think they also go very well with each other.

There were a couple of external factors. For one thing, Sam arbitrarily decided that one of the babies was named Fifi, which we were not okay with, but we took his opinion into consideration when we named Ph0ebe.

Cl@ra’s name was a bit of a come from behind victory – we talked about it for the first time on the way to the hospital. We liked it with Ph0ebe and the middle names, too (R0berts is another family name). We also got a kick out of naming Baby A Cl@ra and Baby B Ph0ebe. I’m completely in love with it now, even though originally I thought it was a touch too feminine for my tastes. It edged out Calla, which my husband didn’t think coordinated with Ph0ebe.

There’s also this:
Origin of the name Ph0ebe: Feminine form of the Greek Phoibos (bright one), which is derived from phoibos (bright).

Origin of the name Cl@ra: from the Latin clārus (bright, clear, famous).

Not matchy-matchy, but kinda fun, right?

(Ph0ebe is on the left/top, in the pic).

Liz writes:

We could use some help naming our second daughter. My name is Elizabeth (Liz) and my husband is William (Will). We have a two and half year old daughter Emery Jane. She goes by both names on a pretty regular basis along with an array of pet names and EJ. Her name is very family rooted. Her first name is my husband’s grandmother’s maiden name. Her middle name is my MIL middle name as well as her mother’s middle name. My grandfather went by EJ and my little sister also has these initials. I was not messing around when I named this child. This leads us to issue number one, I feel like my next child needs to have a name with as much meaning. To be honest I am perfectly fine with giving her a first name that is not a family name but…Will she be sad I didn’t give her a name with more meaning? Issue number two is the naming style I fell into naming DD1 Emery. I inadvertently landed in the “trendy unisex” naming category. This is not our naming style at all. I loved the name because of the family history not because I like unisex surnames. Do I need to keep this naming style? I personally feel the sibset needs to be cohesive. I am ok with it being eclectic but I don’t want people scratching their heads! If we had/have a son he would have been or will be August Lowell (both family names) or Byron Thomas (both family names). Our last name is DeMontel (it is a hard DE)… this nixes any name ending in EL as a first name and we cannot use Ann as a first name either because it sounds like AND. I am ok with it in the middle. I don’t want to use her first and middle name on a regular basis like we do with Emery Jane.

Here is where we are at for a girl: (The middle names are not set in stone)

Frances Eliza: Frances is a family name and obviously Elizabeth is my name but it is also my mother’s middle name, husband’s Aunt’s and Grandmother’s name.

Antonia Elise: Antonia is not a family name but we would call her Annie. My mother’s name is Ann so variations of Ann or names where Annie can easily be a nickname work for us.

Celia McBride: Celia is not a family name and is not tied into the family in anyway besides the initials being the same as my sisters. McBride is my mother’s maiden name.

Other names we have considered:

Anita

Cordelia nn Cora or just Cora

Eliza (I am really trying not to use another E name)

Susannah

If I had it my way she would be Louise Larrabee. Even though Louise is not a family name I just love the alliteration and we would call or Lulu or Lola. As I said before I am not dead set on a family name in the first name spot.

Family names (or variations of these) we can use:

Eva

Elizabeth

Ann/Anna

Marie

Mae

Frances

Isobel (even though our last name ends in EL I am fine with a little rhyming in the middle spot)

Christina

Ilene

Margaret

Ruth

Greene

Larrabee

Mcbride

Please help! :)

 
“I was not messing around when I named this child” is one of my favorite lines from any baby-name question ever. I feel like we could put that on a t-shirt.

I’m envious of your family name list. What a great list. I would LOVE to have the middle name McBride. Or Margaret. Or Ruth. Or Larrabee. Or Greene. Or ….you get the idea. It’s an unusually rich list.

The good news about names for first babies is that, as a group, I suspect they contain more than the usual number of names that aren’t the parents’ usual style. For one thing, many families have naming traditions for firstborns, so a family might feel pressured into using a name such as, say, Robert, when their naming style for subsequent children is more along the lines of Jasper and Oliver. For another thing, it’s common for parents to end up in exactly the situation you’re in: realizing after-the-fact that the first baby’s name is not the style they want to continue with.

In your case, I think it’s completely fine to go with a sentimental/significant name for the firstborn and not continue it with subsequent children. Children will have unpredictable reactions to name issues (some won’t care at all; some will be mildly pleased; some will still be talking about it in accusing tones when they’re in their forties), but I think it’s common enough in our society to use a significant name for the firstborn (and not for subsequent children) that it won’t be hurtful or seem to “mean anything” about the way you feel about her. And “We really really loved the name” is a special thing, too. My own daughter has a name that isn’t after anyone, but she likes (so far!) for me to tell her how I could barely suggest her name to Paul because I was so afraid he’d say he didn’t like it—and that her middle name is the name he couldn’t stand not to use for a daughter.

Emery is still on the feminine side of unisex: according to the Social Security Administration, in 2010 it was given to 1,016 girls and 308 boys. I suspect the name’s similarity to other Em-based girl names will help keep it feminine. But this touch of non-frilliness seems like it will help the name go even better with some of the other names on your list. Emery may be more modern-sounding and Frances more pleasingly vintage, but both Emery and Francis are used for boys. Larrabee and Greene, too, both have the unisex sound.

This will vary from person to person, but to me, Emery and Antonia is the least compatible pair on the list. I think Emery and Celia works: the 5-letters and 3-syllables help tie them together, as do their light sounds and vowel endings. And I love the name Celia McBride—I want it for myself! If McBride and DeMontel seems like too many capital letters in the middle of names, I like Celia Greene to give her a more unisex name like her sister’s (and also the same 3-1-3 rhythm, unless that would make you feel pressured to continue it), and Celia Ruth just because I like it (3-1-3 rhythm again). I also like Celia Ann, not only for sound but for significance, but I don’t like the initials.

I love Frances Eliza, but I prefer for initials not to spell things. This is purely personal preference, and FED isn’t bad. I like Frances McBride, Frances Greene, Frances Cordelia.

I also LOVE Louise Larrabee. Emery Jane and Louise Larrabee is a stunning set of names. I like how they’d each have one traditional girl name and one family surname.

Name update! Liz writes:

We really were not set on a name until she came out with a head full of dark hair just like her sister. I thought she might be Eliza or Celia but she entered this world and we knew she was Frances. Frances Eliza DeMontel was born Dec 22 at 8:55am, 7lbs 14oz, 20 and 1/4in. She looks basically Identical to her big sister but with slightly more hair and a dimple. Thanks again for the help!